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  1. #51
    Forum Newbie thebimguy's Avatar
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    I understand that I will have to suck it up and just deal with however many hours I went over. I am not trying to be dishonest about it. One thing I am unsure about is how do you define the scope? When we originally talked, they asked for about 15 architectural sheets, and I was given some drawings for a renovation project to follow, what I am doing is a ground up project. When I send progress sheets for them to look at they send it back with comments. One example is, I completed some elevation details for a certain area by following the project they gave me and I got comments back telling me that the details are incorrect, need some more cabinets in this area or flip the sink in this area, etc., when in the set I was given shows exactly how I originally draw it the first time and the areas are not exactly the same, they are two different project. When I have questions about something they referred back to me to the set they gave me. It is getting a bit frustrating and sometimes I would just want to give the money back (I was given a partial payment to start)
    Another thing is they are asking to place a Building Analysis Code information, is that something I need to do? I straight up told them I needed them to give me that information and I can place it in the drawings, I know you have to have this but not sure how to do this, they just told me to copy and paste from the other project.

    On the other note about using Revit licenses, I am not using a pirated license and I cannot confirm or deny that I am using my employer's computer and license. After I am done with this project (if I ever finish it), I am considering using some of the money to save for a computer but I know this will not be enough as they are expensive. This is something that bothers me from the beginning, if I used my employer's computer I have the risk of potentially being fired but if I ask and I am denied then I am out of side work. How do people ask their employer if they can use their software, I feel that as long as I am doing this after work there shouldn't be an issue but that is just my opinion.

  2. #52
    Super Moderator Cad64's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebimguy View Post
    if I used my employer's computer I have the risk of potentially being fired but if I ask and I am denied then I am out of side work. How do people ask their employer if they can use their software, I feel that as long as I am doing this after work there shouldn't be an issue but that is just my opinion.
    If you want to do side work, you should get yourself set up with a computer at home and purchase licenses for the software you need to do the work. I think Tanner's situation was a very unique one where he was allowed to use company software, but I believe he was using it at home on his own computer, not in the office.

    I can't imagine very many employers who would be willing to finance their employees freelance adventures after hours. They really can't stop you from doing it on your own time at home with your own computer and software, but I seriously doubt they would be willing to allow you to do the work in the office, since it's 100% profit for you and 0% for them. Not only are they paying for the equipment, software, supplies, etc., but they are also paying the electric bill to keep the lights on and run the computer, so it's actually costing them quite a bit for you to do this. It's also a bit of a sticky situation because if you're taking on work that your employer could be doing, you are now a competitor.

    I would be very careful about approaching them at this point, since you have already been doing it behind their backs. They probably won't be too happy if they find out.
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  3. #53
    Forum Newbie thebimguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cad64 View Post
    If you want to do side work, you should get yourself set up with a computer at home and purchase licenses for the software you need to do the work. I think Tanner's situation was a very unique one where he was allowed to use company software, but I believe he was using it at home on his own computer, not in the office.

    I can't imagine very many employers who would be willing to finance their employees freelance adventures after hours. They really can't stop you from doing it on your own time at home with your own computer and software, but I seriously doubt they would be willing to allow you to do the work in the office, since it's 100% profit for you and 0% for them. Not to mention the fact that they are paying the electric bill to keep the lights on and run the computer while you're making money on their equipment, so it's actually costing them money for you to do this. It's also a bit of a sticky situation because if you're taking on work that your employer could be doing, you are now a competitor.

    I would be very careful about approaching them at this point, since you have already been doing it behind their backs. They probably won't be too happy if they find out.
    I am actually using a laptop and doing this at home. I am not competing with my company as they only do construction, not drafting. But yeah, it would be different it this will be happening at the office. Like i said, I plan on buying a laptop or desktop later after this.

  4. #54
    Luminous Being tzframpton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebimguy View Post
    I am actually using a laptop and doing this at home. I am not competing with my company as they only do construction, not drafting. But yeah, it would be different it this will be happening at the office. Like i said, I plan on buying a laptop or desktop later after this.
    You may not be doing this in the office, but you're using their laptop, their software, etc. Competing is one facet, using their tools in another facet. Most companies wouldn't let employees use their work truck for personal use, or the company saw to build decks on the side, and so forth. But, I think we all understand the situation and we all can agree you're on unlawful ground here.

    Quote Originally Posted by thebimguy View Post
    I understand that I will have to suck it up and just deal with however many hours I went over. I am not trying to be dishonest about it. One thing I am unsure about is how do you define the scope? When we originally talked, they asked for about 15 architectural sheets, and I was given some drawings for a renovation project to follow, what I am doing is a ground up project. When I send progress sheets for them to look at they send it back with comments. One example is, I completed some elevation details for a certain area by following the project they gave me and I got comments back telling me that the details are incorrect, need some more cabinets in this area or flip the sink in this area, etc., when in the set I was given shows exactly how I originally draw it the first time and the areas are not exactly the same, they are two different project. When I have questions about something they referred back to me to the set they gave me. It is getting a bit frustrating and sometimes I would just want to give the money back (I was given a partial payment to start)
    Another thing is they are asking to place a Building Analysis Code information, is that something I need to do? I straight up told them I needed them to give me that information and I can place it in the drawings, I know you have to have this but not sure how to do this, they just told me to copy and paste from the other project.
    With the use of your company's hardware and software aside, from what I can tell here (again) is that you gave a hard bid quote on something you were inexperienced on. How do you define a scope? Well, first off, you have to be experienced in properly estimating this type of work and since you are not then you will have a hard time understanding expectations. All of this comes from experience. The more experience you have in this, the better you will understand how to properly scope the work, with proper inclusions and exclusions.

    It's hard to help you with the question of scope because every job is different, and you can't just jump in a forum and ask "how do I define scope?" My suggestion would be to seek someone local that you can get mentor-ship from. If you can't, you can still go about it solo, but next time be much more up front with your client. Let them know you're doing this as side work and ask them to help you out by really defining what their ultimate expectations are. I've done this plenty of times in the past when I was doing side work, and the clients were almost always willing to really help me out by going over many details that they expected to have on the finished product. My first side jobs were in the $100-$250 range, so you definitely hit a good sized job for your first. Just keep at it, and lean on the client for as much information as possible. Sell yourself cheap to gain their attention for now which gives you two things: extra money, and something money can't buy, which is experience. You'll get better at this in time.

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  5. #55
    Luminous Being tzframpton's Avatar
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    Another thing... I think it's kind of cool that I posted on this thread almost ten years ago to the day when it was resurrected. Who knew ten years ago I'd be where I am today. Many thanks to the guys on this forum, that's for sure.

    -TZ
    Tannar Z. Frampton ™ | Frampton & Associates, Inc.

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