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unique elevation problem


joe51

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Hi all. I was hoping to get some advice from an experienced guru.

 

I am seeking solutions that will work in MAP 3D 2011, or Civil 2010 or both.

 

Here's the problem. I am producing 3d points with object data in MAP3D. Processing the data in Civil is not an option. Map does not allow for object data to be coded into a text file for import the way civil does, so I am using map import and importing a .shp file. This creates the points and Object data as required, but the only way I can create the .shp file produces a 0 elevation (z = 0). So the end result is about 90,000 points in 20 different files that have 0 elevation. I need that z value to reflect the actual elevation of the point as it would if I could import it using a text file such as can be done in civil. My client is using Civil, so if theres a quick fix in Civil I would be interested to know.

 

Ideals Ive had: Each point has a 3d poly drawn through it at the appropriate elevation. If I could somehow project the points to that line, then problem solved, but I cannot modify the X,Y values. I also thought there might be a way to get CAD to pull those z values from a spreadsheed based on cooralating Point number, y value, or some other unique identifyer to tie which elevation goes with which point.

 

I really feel like I have researched this to death, and I am just stuck with manually editing all those points. Any good suggestions out there? :unsure:

 

Just to be clear. Blocks are not an acceptable solution. These must be CAD points with object data, and I have to process the data in Map 3d. We are collecting the data in TDS software and exporting text and .shp files using forsight dxm.

 

Thanks guys

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I read above and don't really get what your trying to do.

 

What is your source data a CIV3d dwg, GIS shx file, a MAP dwg why is the output from TDS not useable (dont know a lot about TDS but know what it is)

 

What is your output requirement xyz dwg contours plines ?

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I read above and don't really get what your trying to do.

 

What is your source data a CIV3d dwg, GIS shx file, a MAP dwg why is the output from TDS not useable (dont know a lot about TDS but know what it is)

 

What is your output requirement xyz dwg contours plines ?

 

I see your point. Sorry for the vague explanation. I was trying to keep it short. Let me try and walk through the situation.

 

I am collecting 3d points using TDS. These points carry standard descriptions. Attached to each description are specific object data that must be completed. For example, if I collect a centerline of road point, the object data to be filled in would be width, striping type, collection method, and comments. This is just one example. I have about 40 different types of objects. I am using Map 3d to create the points with Object data, and I do not have the option to upgrade to Civil. Since map does not allow you to code object data into an ascii file the way Civil does, I am limited as to how I can create these points. The only practical way I have found is to create a shape file from my field data using the TDS produced program Forsight dxm, but TDS is limited in this regard (at least from what I can tell). After much work and struggle, TDS will create a shape file that has points with the appropriate object data to be imported into CAD. Here is the catch - every point imported this way has a 0 elevation. The shape file is flattened to 0 before it ever gets into MAP.... Terrible.:reallymad:

 

My deliverable seems simple, and unfortunately, we bid it as though it were simple :oops:. I need to deliver a CAD drawing with CAD points (not attribute blocks) that has a 3d polyline drawn through them.

 

I am a surveyor, so I have other software that will create attribute blocks at the appropriate elevation and draw a 3d polyline through them for me. :D Then it is just a copy paste deal to get the poly line into the deliverable drawing.

 

I do not have any method of moving CAD points to the appropriate elevation as the only way I can get them to have the appropriate object data associated causes a 0 elevation. The only way I have found so far is to select each one individually and modify the properties.:o

 

I am searching for a way to automate the process of assigning each of these CAD points with the appropriate elevation.

 

The best ideals ive had so far are maybe a routine that can assign them from a spreadsheet by corralating point numbers and applying the elevation. It would also work if I could project the points up to the polyline vertices without changing the X and Y value.

 

I have found no customization files that can do this, and I dont really have any other ideals of how to get it done.

 

My client is running Civil, so if there is a "quick fix" that works in Civil, he may be able to do it for me. The catch is, it is my job to make sure the points and object data are correct. I cant just ask them to process the points for me - if they did, what am I being paid for?

 

Please let me know if this is easier to understand.

 

If anyone can lend some advice, I would greatly appreciate it.

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Quick and dirty fix would be get TDS to export out a XYZC file ie xyz plus a code

 

eg 110.121,4546.236,35.650,CENTRELINE

 

This can be read into autocad map civil3d etc in various ways simplest is a "Autocad point", better is the point is created on the code layer. Lots of lisp examples here to do this import.

 

We design roads so have feature surveys done all the time yes we use civ3D, whilst you have map is that what was bought ? As Map is a part of Civ3d.

 

We use a 3rd party program to string all the codes together from a library of every code we would ever use. TDS should be capable of doing this possiblly exporting a dwg or dxf that you can read in.

 

Our coding library has been around for 20 years but is updated every now and again to reflect software changes. if you want centreline, width, type, then our guys would do it simply as eg Lanedash300, lanedash100, = lane line, dashed type, width 100mm in 1 code. Easy to import in. Actually it would be something like 4010102 Centrebitumen 401, 01 100mm, 02 dashed numbers are quicker on data logger.

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Im not sure I understand what you mean BigAl. I believe XYZC file is very similar to the P,N,E,Z,D (Point Number, Northinig, Easting, Elevation, Description) file we are used to exporting? Really its just an acii text file formatted to be read into CAD or other softwares? This can be used to create CAD points on the appropriate layer - agreed, but MAP does not allow anything to be added to this file. For example, I cannot create a file that is Point Number, Northinig, Easting, Elevation, Description, Feature 1, Feature 2, Feature 3. Map simply does not have that option and that may not be programmed in as it can with C3D.

 

I can export DWG and DXF from TDS, but it creates Attribute Blocks rather than CAD Points, and also does not assign object data.

 

Care to ellaborate a littlel more on the 3rd party program used to string codes together.

 

TDS is being used to collect the data and the features. When the crew collects a point, they enter a description which cues TDS to which set of object data to ask for. For example, if they collected a road, it would get the width and striping questions mentioned above. If they collected an overhead line, it would prompt for height above ground, collection method, and comments. If they collected a drain pipe, it would ask the flow elevations of both ends, pipe type, collection method, etc.

 

So TDS is collecting the data, but the only method exporting that data from TDS that MAP will read in as points with object data is a .shp file. Any other export method leaves us with assigning object data to all 90k points, which is much more time consuming than adding an elevation to each one.

 

I appreciate your willingness to try and tackle this problem with me. I just dont fully understand your response. Please clarify on the XYZC file and the third party program.

 

Thanks, BigAl.

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Understand a bit more now yes xyzc =P,N,E,Z,d its a USA v's Aus thing.

 

Anyway to the problem I think you expecting to much from civil3d in the streets your collecting massive amounts of information compared to a normal field survey. This information needs to be put into a database type structure, access or excel from this you can manipulate the data into a form accepted by CIV3d as an example a powerline point 10m high 240volts would be put on layer power-10-240 a line appears connecting same named points. You can then take advantage of grouping layers -la off "power*" turns all power layers off.

 

Map is designed as being a GIS system using lots of feature internal & external database links, Civ3D is a civil designing system using points lines etc the two do blend but I think the way around your problem is to treat the two seperately but imported into the 1 drawing. Had a quick look its maybe part of Map to read a database directly I am sure I have seen it.

 

If you output all the points into a Access database you can create penzd files to re import.

 

The survey software to create the field plan is "Stringer" www.civilsurveysoloutions.com.au

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I appreciate your time and insight into the problem. In case anyone else has the problem here is what we worked out. I am drawing the line work using our Survey software and deleting the attribute blocks (Map) and providing that to the client along with a text file fomatted as follows: Point Number, Northinig, Easting, Elevation, Description, Feature 1, Feature 2, Feature 3, etc. Using this method, he is able to quickly get the CAD points with object data, and he can reference in the line work I created on the appropriate elevation. I would rather create the points on my end as this would give me the chance to review more thoroughly, but this the best we could come up with. I think he also has to setup an import style for each code we used, but without buying a seat, I really don't know.

 

If I could make one improvement to Map, it would be to add the ability to assign object data to points while importing a comma seperated text file. It seems this would be more attuned to Map's purpose than Civil's.

 

Again, thanks for your help, BigAl. I will be looking into MAP's database connections to solve the same problem in the future, assuming the client comes back after this nightmare. Also, big thanks to CADTutor for hosting this question. FYI, the link above did not work for me.

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Re link google "Stringer software" try__________ old name

 

This one works :D. Links me to the home page. I would post the link, but the mods still dont know me well enough to post links :cry:.

 

Dont have much time to look into it today, but I will.

 

Thanks again.

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