Having trouble deciding on AutoCAD MEP or CADmep+

Hi, we will be updating our autoCAD to 2012 shortly and will be getting an MEP package but I cant quite decide on which to get. We are an engineering consultant company doing all disiplines. We are doing a lot of co-ordination work at the minute. I am leaning toward CADmep+ at the minute just from what I have read online. Can anyone give me their opinions on the matter? Before I commit to anything we will be organising demos of both AutoCAD MEP and CADmep+. Any comments are appreciated.

If you're an engineering consulting company then I highly recommend against CAD-MEP, and go with AutoCAD MEP. It's way more expensive than necessary and unless you plan on 100% coordinating entire projects, then sending the file directly to the fabrication shop, it's not worth your time or investment. Hell, it's even cheaper to buy the Autodesk Design Suite Ultimate for even cheaper than CAD-MEP!!

 

I give a good description of CAD-MEP here: http://www.cadtutor.net/forum/showthread.php?52966-CADDuct-worth-the-Money&highlight=CAD-Duct

How steep is the AutoCAD MEP learning curve. The Quote I got for CADmep+ wasn't very expensive at all (£8000 for 3 floating network licenses). Although it might make more sense to go for the autodesk suite. What exactly is navis works used for? I have not used it in the past. Also I have read that the AutoCAD mep library is made up of generic parts meaning we will have to re draw pretty much all the blocks for our co-ordination process.

How steep is the AutoCAD MEP learning curve. The Quote I got for CADmep+ wasn't very expensive at all (£8000 for 3 floating network licenses). Although it might make more sense to go for the autodesk suite. What exactly is navis works used for? I have not used it in the past.

First, my apologies, CADmep+ is made by the same company that produces CAD-Duct, etc. CADmep+ isn't a design to fab software like I was originally assuming, which is a good thing. Now that I've got myself more familiar with CADmep+ it is definitely closer to what you're after, however I personally would still consider the following key points:

 

 

• CADmep+ is a third party so compatibility will become an issue at some point when you share files, if you ever do.
  
• CADmep+ developer's support has been known to not be that great (read some posts in this forum in fact). You don't get much support with Autodesk products, but communities like this give you much more support from real users since the actual user base of Autodesk's software is much more vast.
  
• You still need AutoCAD to run it, so consider the cost just to run CADmep+
  
• It's not native Autodesk products.
  
• Autodesk Design Suite gives you literally every possible option from what is considered the "standard" in CAD software. Revit and Navisworks is a huge benefit, especially if you're an engineering firm since Revit has engineering functionality and Navisworks is the leader in coordination software.
  

Also I have read that the AutoCAD mep library is made up of generic parts meaning we will have to re draw pretty much all the blocks for our co-ordination process.

AutoCAD MEP has ANSI standard parts for things such as your pipe/duct/conduit libraries, which is a good thing. No need to recreate flanges of pipe, or duct elbows, or true O.D. of conduits, etc. However, AutoCAD MEP does not keep track of actual manufacturer's equipment or valves or anything related to that. That doesn't mean they're not usable because they are.

 

If CADmep+ actually has manufacturer cataloged equipment, valves, accessories, etc, then that would be a great selling point although I would be a tad bit skeptical and here's why: There are far too many manufacturers and products to keep up with in the world today. CADmep+ cannot possibly maintain such a vast library that will make everyone happy. I would do some research on what exactly they claim to have cataloged, as well as how often do they update the physical dimensions of these virtual equipment models when a product line changes from the manufacturer. Just because a website or salesman says "We have actual manufacturer equipment models" doesn't mean it's as complete as what your company would actually use, so proceed with caution. Also if you're on the engineering side of things, I don't see how you'd need exact equipment dimensions to begin with anyways? That usually goes through the submittal process from the general contractor and sub-contractor.

 

In all I will say this... Map Software does make really great products. I have seen first hand the amount of effort they put into their software packages and it definitely is extensive to say the least. The thing I worry about for most people is they buy up this third party software, they get accustom to it after years of use, and you get stuck in "their way" of doing things. This can also be something that can cause time and effort in the future if you ever need to make changes as a company for the market you're in. What I specifically mean by this, is upcoming software packages such as the Revit software line. Revit is being pushed as more of a standard, especially from engineers, and for good reason.

 

This will be a decision you and your company should look at very closely. Hope this helps some.

 

*EDIT* For the record, let me make something very clear. If you're looking at strictly between AutoCAD MEP vs CADmep+, you will be more satisfied with CADmep+, as out of the box it will have better and easier tools. AutoCAD MEP is built off the AutoCAD Architecture core, in which all they did was try and mimic Revit's intuitive concept. Although Autodesk made a good attempt with AutoCAD MEP, it never really will be what it should be, because Revit MEP already exists.

Thank you for your reply. Just spent the day messing around with the trial. Its looking like I might go the suite route. Trying to get a few demos organised in the office before we settle for a solution. Oh and the reason I liked the idea of manufacturers equipment models is that we would normally spec valves and equipment for our clients and usually draw these up when co-ordinating facilities. Its a pity map software doesnt supply trial software as its very hard to get an idea of their products. Ill just reserve judgment till we get our demonstrations.

Oh and the reason I liked the idea of manufacturers equipment models is that we would normally spec valves and equipment for our clients and usually draw these up when co-ordinating facilities.

Don't think that AutoCAD MEP falls completely short because it doesn't. The equipment, valves, accessories, etc, they are all extremely close to certain standards. For instance:

 

 

• in AutoCAD MEP, they have a "grooved fittings" catalog. Even though it's not Victaulic brand, it still matches exactly with the catalog of Victaulic's elbows, couplings, etc.
  
• in AutoCAD MEP, I started a job that has 12" lugged butterfly valves for a chilled water system we did about a year ago. The specified valves were Nibco brand. The standard lugged butterfly valve in AutoCAD MEP was only 1/32" off in dimension compared to the Nibco brand valves.
  

 

Those are a couple of quick examples I can provide. Not only that but you can always build your own library of items in AutoCAD MEP and maintain it in-house. However, I will say, that if you migrate and adopt Revit MEP, you'll find that a lot of manufacturers already supply their parts, equipment, and accessories on their website for free, available for download. A lot of the equipment already has their data engineered into them as well, helping you calculate loads, etc directly in Revit. Just food for thought is all.

 

Revit might actually be a better solution since you're in the pre-engineering phase of the jobs. But, I don't know exactly how your company operates so it's hard to tell. Once again I'll press that this decision of which software should you buy needs to be thoroughly looked at.