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HVAC installations 3D


myself

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Hello everybody,the reason of this thread is the fact that i was asked to create a complete 3Dmodel of a HVAC installation, the program I will be using is AutoCAD MEP. i've done some 3D before, but never of the complete project, I’ve worked onsome details and then use them to explain some parts of the project.

 

So, I wouldlike to hear from people of had already done similar things, and thereforecould possibly help me with some tips to accomplish this huge mission I have infront of me.

 

Thank you very much guys….

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Well, i’m basically designing an installation with Air Handling Units, Chillers, Boilers,Pipes, Ducts, valves, etc. It’s a basic installation for offices building. So, all I need to do is the 3D model of HVAC installation to send to architect for him to place it inside his model, in a perfect world this two would combine perfectly.

 

I thought the architect would be using REVIT, once it is the most famous program thateverybody have been talking, but it seems like this one prefers to work with AutoCAD Architectural or something similar, they just told me that a dwg file would befine.

 

Perfect now would be to have 3D model of a HVAC installation so that I could get some ideasout of it….

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Office building...OK. How many floors are we talking?

 

Where will the mechanical room(s) be located?

 

All in 3D. How much experience do you have with AutoCAD MEP? Can you at least find your way around in it?

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Here are some tips for using AutoCAD MEP:

 

  1. When you open AutoCAD MEP, click the "Quick New" icon first. This template has all the HVAC and Piping systems already loaded so you don't have to build each system. If you type STYLEMANAGER at the command line, expand the HVAC Objects > Duct System Definitions button, you'll notice about 20 HVAC Ducting systems already in place. Same for Piping Objects.
  2. For your equipment, you won't find much online. I would just use the submittal for the dimensional data for each piece of equipment, and build it in 3D using normal AutoCAD solids. Then, use the MVPARTCONVERT command to quickly and easily convert it to a MultiView Part in AutoCAD MEP.
  3. For piping equipment, you can find lots of stuff on Bell & Gossett's website here. Download the STP files, then drag/drop them into the drawing space. They will automatically convert to 3D solids. This is good for pumps, heat exchangers, expansion tanks, etc.
  4. When you send your files to the architect, since they are using Revit, do not send a DWG. It's best to export to IFC. You access this by going to the Application Button > Export > IFC. DWG files are horrible in Revit, use IFC instead.
  5. The rest is just simply knowing how to use the AutoCAD MEP duct and piping objects to route your ducts and pipes. My suggestion is to use multiple modelspace viewports to really see what you're doing and how it's routing in 3D space.

Hope this helps. :)

 

 

PS: Maybe this thread should be moved to the AutoCAD MEP forum?

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thank you very much for your help guys... very helpful, believe me.

 

One question, when i am working on Revit, it'spretty simple to work on different levels since Revit has that structure, while working on Autocad MEP, things don’t work exactly like that, and i found it a bit confusing after some time, when you have elements on different levels.

How do you manage with this problem, do you have any tips that could help me.

 

I willwrite here my doubts while working on the model…

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You can utilize Levels if you use the Project Navigator, but that's a beast of a system to learn. It's not easy to just "jump right in" so proceed with caution.

 

In Revit, everything is based on Levels so it's a ton easier since that's how Revit was designed.

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Here are some tips for using AutoCAD MEP:

 

  1. When you open AutoCAD MEP, click the "Quick New" icon first. This template has all the HVAC and Piping systems already loaded so you don't have to build each system. If you type STYLEMANAGER at the command line, expand the HVAC Objects > Duct System Definitions button, you'll notice about 20 HVAC Ducting systems already in place. Same for Piping Objects.
  2. For your equipment, you won't find much on line. I would just use the submittal for the dimensional data for each piece of equipment, and build it in 3D using normal AutoCAD solids. Then, use the MVPARTCONVERT command to quickly and easily convert it to a MultiView Part in AutoCAD MEP.
  3. For piping equipment, you can find lots of stuff on Bell & Gossett's website here. Download the STP files, then drag/drop them into the drawing space. They will automatically convert to 3D solids. This is good for pumps, heat exchangers, expansion tanks, etc.
  4. When you send your files to the architect, since they are using Revit, do not send a DWG. It's best to export to IFC. You access this by going to the Application Button > Export > IFC. DWG files are horrible in Revit, use IFC instead.
  5. The rest is just simply knowing how to use the AutoCAD MEP duct and piping objects to route your ducts and pipes. My suggestion is to use multiple modelspace viewports to really see what you're doing and how it's routing in 3D space.

Hope this helps. :)

 

 

PS: Maybe this thread should be moved to the AutoCAD MEP forum?

 

but it seems like this one prefers to work with AutoCAD Architectural or something similar, they just told me that a dwg file would be fine.

 

Where did you get the Architect was using Revit?

 

 

I realize you know more About AutoCAD MEP than me, but, if the Architect wants .dwg he should probably send a .dwg. You say nothing available on line then give a link to on line site.

 

Have you actually tried calling a manufacturer and not received a response? I get 3D and 2D files from most manufacturers.

 

Thread moved to AutoCAD MEP.

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ohhhhh, I mis-read his second post, sorry!! Scratch that... if he's using AutoCAD Architecture, then just send the native DWG file. They'll be able to import perfectly. Good catch SLW.

 

:)

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Another question…. When im drawing a pipe on Autocad MEP, if the size is smaller tha 200, it only shows a line instead of the real size of the pipe, however if i turn the size bigger than 200, the pipe shows up with all the fittings…. Is there a way to change this?

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Go to Style Manager > Piping Objects > Pipe System Definitions. Click on the pipe system you're working with, then on the right pane, click the "Single Line Graphics" tab. Uncheck both display settings to always show double lined linework.

 

:)

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Thank you very much, that help you gave me with the piping size worked just fine.

 

Now I am trying to figure out how can I set a system to use a specific duct fitting, for instance,I would like to set the short radius elbow for all my duct systems, however by default they are set to medium, which turns out to be annoying having to change them all the time.

 

Any help on this particular case?

 

By the way,I am using the project navigator that you had mentioned before, it’s veryuseful, even because I can work on separate parts of the project and then join them all on a view, making it easier and lighter to work. ;)

 

there's no need to answer my question about the duct fittings, i've figured out where i could change that option.

Edited by myself
i've figured out the way to change the default duct fitting....
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Glad to see you are utilizing the Project Navigator. Many people overlook how great of a tool this really is.

 

And to answer your question, type DUCTPREFERENCES at the command line. Go to the Parts tab. This is how you control your "preset parts" for each duct object. Also, be sure to browse the other tabs, setting your flex types, vanes/no vanes, duct lining/insulation, automatic text labels, and default duct routing settings.

 

FYI, put the Flex Duct segment mode to the 3rd icon, "spline", and never change it. BIG time saver and it just works far better than any of the other two flex duct settings. Took me a long time to figure that one out, lol.

 

:)

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Hello there, just anotherquestion.... how do i plug a duct that doesn’t connect to any other, forinstance, i have a duct with branches coming out, and then the main duct is pluggedat the end, not connecting to anywhere. I want to select a piece to plug it.

Did I express myself in theway you could understand :D

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Here is another question sent to the table for anyone to answer. Probably more directly to Stykface, who taught me about the project navigator.

 

Which criteria do you have to create a new construct file on project navigator? Do you split the project by system’s, rooms or specific area of the building? I've done a quite complex central station that now has some pipes leaving to the room next to this one,that one is also quite complex with all the valves and pumps, not mention the three chillers, so i thought that i could create a new construction file to this new space. Once then i have a view file where i join all the elements to create a single model of the building. What do you think? I know that i shouldn’t split systems for more than a file, but then which rule should i follow,because having a system per construction file may turn more difficult to coordinate a space with many systems.

 

Once again, I understand if you don’t get what I mean… just writing while thinking about my problem.

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I get what you mean, but this is something you'll have to answer yourself. There's no "right way" to do it, you'll just have to assess the job for yourself and choose what route works best for you.

 

:)

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The 3D is going well and the engineer is pretty excited with what i have done so far.Until now i have been working on my laptop, which is pretty good and is giving me no problems at all, for you to have an idea, here it goes the main characteristics of my machine:

 

- CPU: I7-720QM

 

- VGA: ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5730 VRAM: 1GB

 

-Memory: 4GB

 

-16.0” HD/LED – plus a 19” monitor connected tothe laptop

 

Saying this, i had to mention the engineer my laptop is good but a desktop with a good capacity would be necessary further on the model, I don’t know if this is your opinion or not, that’s why I came here to ask you all. However he gave me the answer I was willing to hear, write on paper the computer you think necessary to accomplish the model and we will find a way to bring it to you.

 

And this yes, it’s what this thread is all about… which computer do you think would be nice, I don’t want anything over the limits, just one decent machine to have the job done. The crises in Portugal is pretty bad as you know and i dont want to give a wrong signal to my colleagues, asking for a expensive machine on difficult moments like this we are going through.

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Honestly, your machine is plenty capable if you max out the RAM. Anything more than the computer you currently have (with added RAM) will give you only a moderate increase in overall performance to be honest.

 

But if you must, just remember bigger is better. Processor, RAM, and Video Card all come into play. RAM should be maxed out no matter what, especially since RAM is so freaking cheap right now. Core i7 Sandy Bridge is the best processor to get, and search on Autodesk's certified hardware list for the best video card your budget will allow.

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