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Requesting a free software recommendation to help with a home project.


AndyInTampa

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I'm not a designer or a drafter and I don't even know what terms to use in a Google search to find my solution. Here's my project.

 

I have to replace 2 medicine cabinets in my bathroom. There are 12 holes in the wall from the previous cabinets and I need to calculate where to drill the holes on the inside of the new medicine cabinets so that they line up with the old holes while placing my new cabinets correctly in position on the wall.

 

I've downloaded and tried TigerCAD, DraftIT, FreeCAD, and DraftSight, but I don't know anything about how to use them. I can measure everything with my tape measure to 1/16". All the software uses "units". I can't even get a rectangle drawn in the software that I know is 63" x 60-3/4" (that's the wall area).

 

I don't think I need it to be 3D. Each cabinet will be represented by 3 rectangles, whose dimensions I know, displayed side-by-side inside another rectangle representing the wall. Then I need to place the 12 holes on the sketch at their specific locations and let the software tell me where those holes are inside each of the cabinets in relation to the innermost rectangle.

 

I know this can be done manually, but I don't want to mess up the calculations and make the cabinets look like swiss cheese from the inside. Does anyone have a recommendation? Sweet Home 3D came close, but it only uses fractions down to 1/8". I use fractions, because that's what's on the tape measure.

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Draftsight will do fine, If i were you i would goto youtube and watch a few tutorials about basic commands and drafting settings.

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Welcome to CADTutor. :)

Forget about all the old holes.

Presumably the cabinets will be mounted into studs, or other framing members in the wall.

Determine where they are in your wall first, either with a stud sensor, or by rapping

along the drywall with your knuckles and listening to the auditory feedback.

Once you have figured out where the studs are, get out a piece of paper, and draw the relative

location of the medicine cabinet on the wall, and show where the studs are in your drawing.

Since a stud is 1 1/2" wide, you won't need to be accurate to 1/16".

Much as I enjoy doing CAD drawing, there is no need for it in your instance,

unless of course you are just interested in learning to use it.

You will probably find that the wall studs are on 16" centers.

I guess your medicine cabinet is not of the type which is usually inserted through the drywall, into a stud bay

(the void between the studs), so as to get a more flush and space efficient installation by using the

void in the wall. If it is of that type, then you will likely see installation screw holes through the side walls

of your cabinet. I hope that helps you. Just remember, those old holes will be covered by the new

installation, and they are of no consequence at this time. Use a level when you hang it, put in the first screw, then

as you are drilling the second hole keep an eye on the level, and check it again as you are inserting and tightening the screws.

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Dadgad, 4 of the 12 holes are in 2 studs, but I still need to figure out where those holes are in relation to where the cabinets will be. The holes in the cabinets will need to be pre-drilled before I can put up the cabinets. The studs are also not behind the center of the cabinets. The other holes are for the molly bolts to add additional support since the cabinets are flimsy enough that I don't trust them to be held by 1 screw at the top and 1 at the bottom, all of which are off center of the cabinets. I need to lay out where the cabinets will be on the wall. If the holes are drilled wrong, the cabinets will be too close together and doors may not shut properly. Then I'll be drilling new holes and creating swiss cheese.

 

Gassa_au, thank you. I will look for those DraftSight youtube videos. I guess I was hoping for something a little easier that would simply let me input a rectangle size, then I could drag it to where I wanted it and let the software calculate relationships to other objects.

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Sure once you learn how to draw simple lines and circles to your correct geometry you can then draw your rectangle, then postion it to where your happy and then dimension it all up.

you might want to set the units in metric - mm tho so there is less confusion using fractions. Once you set you draw units up to mm one drawing unit = 1mm.

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Go to options and set your units if you are starting a new drawing

See below

draftsight-options.png

 

If you are changing it on an open drawing, it has to be done with properties

 

Hope this helps

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Andy, it seems to me that it would be MUCH easier to put new holes in the cabinet backs wherever you feel they should be.

Once you have done that, get somebody to help you hold it in the desired location, nice and level.

Using an awl or a pencil, mark the new hole centers through your new holes onto the drywall or whatever substrate you have..

Set the cabinet aside and drill and install new molly bolts in your new hole locations.

I like geometry, and am one of a very few carpenters I know (the only maybe), who actually enjoys installing

drywall, the harder the better, because I enjoy the geometric puzzles involved in doing it well.

This would be a lot quicker, and the likelyhood of your getting it right is much higher too, CAD or not.

Not to put you off learning CAD, I love it too! :|

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Sure once you learn how to draw simple lines and circles to your correct geometry you can then draw your rectangle, then postion it to where your happy and then dimension it all up.

you might want to set the units in metric - mm tho so there is less confusion using fractions. Once you set you draw units up to mm one drawing unit = 1mm.

All my measurements are in 16ths. I'll be starting it from scratch.

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Dadgad, thank you for the suggestion, but I am putting new holes in the cabinet backs. I want to line them up with the existing 1/2" holes in the drywall. I don't want to add more holes into the 30-year-old drywall and risk its stability. Also, I'm mounting two 30-7/16" cabinets next to each other in a 63" space. I have to leave some space between them and I don't have enough hands to hold two units level to each other and equally spaced apart while also marking location holes. Even if I make new holes in the drywall, the problem is the same. Either I hire some extra people to hold cabinets or I calculate where to place the holes based on where I've drilled holes in the cabinets. The last option is to buy some wood (1x3) and build a shelf to sit the cabinets on at the correct height while I drill through both cabinet and wall (just thought of that as I was typing). I still prefer calculating using the existing holes since I've already measured their locations on the wall.

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Well, you can't say I didn't try, right? :)

Good luck with them, looking forward to seeing a picture and hearing how it all works out. :beer:

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You don't need a CAD drawing to do the job. It could be done with a piece of paper, a pencil and an awl. Make a template of the back of the cabinet by tracing the outline of it on a piece of paper with a pencil. Cut this out. Tape it to the wall. Use the awl to punch the holes (which you could feel through the paper with your fingers. Remove the template from the wall and transfer it to the back of your cabinet. Drill your holes. Mount the cabinet. Done.

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You don't need a CAD drawing to do the job. It could be done with a piece of paper, a pencil and an awl. Make a template of the back of the cabinet by tracing the outline of it on a piece of paper with a pencil. Cut this out. Tape it to the wall. Use the awl to punch the holes (which you could feel through the paper with your fingers. Remove the template from the wall and transfer it to the back of your cabinet. Drill your holes. Mount the cabinet. Done.

That is an incredible idea if I only had two pieces of paper 30" x 30". Had you given me this idea before I got rid of the box the TV came in, I could have used the cardboard. I might be able to use the cardboard the cabinets are currently in. Feeling the holes will be difficult, but I do have the measurements for the holes from the walls. I could cut out actual sized cardboard and tape them in the correct positions, but they'd have to be perfectly cut or my measurements will be off. They'll have to fit inside the cabinets and I only need to calculate the distance between the cabinets inside-to-inside. I might try it that way just to get the damn things done. Thank you for that idea.

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There has to be an art supply store somewhere near you. Ask them if they have 24x36 sheets of paper. Another option would be find an old roll of Christmas wrapping paper or go to your local big box store and find a roll of "Kraft" paper (it is brown); there is a version that is a purple-ish color too. You'll find either or both in the paint department where the drop cloths are located.

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You really need to forget about the old holes. I have never been on a remodel job where anyone was worried about the old holes. Drywall has no structural value, and new holes won't make it worse. Patch and paint them even if they will be covered up by the cabinets. Then you have more freedom to place your cabinets to align better with the studs, if you can. You will need at least two screws in each cabinet that screws into a stud, one at the top, and one at the bottom. You don't have a choice. molly bolts are not for holding up cabinets and they destroy the back side of the drywall. Cabinets can hold a whole lot of weight, and molly bolts can't. The drywall around them will fail eventually. You also will need at east two more screws in each cabinet near the corners furthest from the studs. use screw-in drywall anchors, big ones, to hold these.

 

Use cabinet screws. they have wider heads, and they come in a couple of different colors, called white, almond, and brown. you can get screw-in drywall anchors big enough for cabinet screws.

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You really need to forget about the old holes. I have never been on a remodel job where anyone was worried about the old holes. Drywall has no structural value, and new holes won't make it worse. Patch and paint them even if they will be covered up by the cabinets. Then you have more freedom to place your cabinets to align better with the studs, if you can. You will need at least two screws in each cabinet that screws into a stud, one at the top, and one at the bottom.

Use cabinet screws. they have wider heads, and they come in a couple of different colors, called white, almond, and brown. you can get screw-in drywall anchors big enough for cabinet screws.

 

Welcome to the party Dana, glad you could make it. :beer:

I love those screw-in drywall anchors, they were not widely used back in my day, but I agree whole heartedly with your assessment,

as a comrade in tools, from the construction trenches. Depending on the screw head shape, it might be nice to use those

finishing cups on the inside, which make an installation look a bit more uptown and increase the bearing surface of the screw on the cabinet back..

Edited by Dadgad
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It's entirely possible some of the existing holes in the wall actually line up with a stud. It would be easy to determine just by sticking a nail or awl into each hole to find out.

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ReMark, in post #4 Andy mentioned that there were a total of 4 old holes into 2 studs.

I guess they must be on 24" centers, as he said the cabinets will span 63".

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Bathroom? I missed that part. Bathroom cabinets are a different matter. They don't have to hold up dishes, potted plants, or horse shoe collections. The weight consideration is probably a bit more forgiving in there, but all the screws into drywall anchors still shouldn't be considered good enough.

 

Now if it were my daughter's bathroom, the cabinets would have to hold several tons and hundreds of colors of nail polish, which never seem to get thrown away, along with the occasional power clipper kit for horses.

 

Pssst, Andy. I'm only a couple hours away from you, but I don't work cheap. My services might cost you a twelve of a good microbrew.

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You really need to forget about the old holes. I have never been on a remodel job where anyone was worried about the old holes. Drywall has no structural value, and new holes won't make it worse. Patch and paint them even if they will be covered up by the cabinets. Then you have more freedom to place your cabinets to align better with the studs, if you can. You will need at least two screws in each cabinet that screws into a stud, one at the top, and one at the bottom. You don't have a choice. molly bolts are not for holding up cabinets and they destroy the back side of the drywall. Cabinets can hold a whole lot of weight, and molly bolts can't. The drywall around them will fail eventually. You also will need at east two more screws in each cabinet near the corners furthest from the studs. use screw-in drywall anchors, big ones, to hold these.

 

As you noticed after you posted this, these are bathroom cabinets. There still appears to be a few things you didn't pick up on. The cabinet holes are not predrilled, so I have to drill them anyway. The cabinets don't get to "align better with the studs". The molly bolts are not for holding up the weight of the cabinets, they are to assist with the weight and the stability of the cabinet.

 

Two 30-7/16" cabinets need to fit side-by-side in a 63 inch space with enough gap between them that they look like two separate cabinets. The fronts are completely mirrored without a border. If they are too close together, they would look like a single cabinet with 6 doors or the doors could simply whack each other and shatter, so layout is crucial.

 

Screw-in drywall anchors may sound easier, but the problems with using them are the same. Let me outline this for you. If I put the anchors in, I still need to calculate where to drill the holes in the cabinets to line up with the anchors. If I don't do it that way, then I have to calculate where to drill the holes to line up with the studs, install the cabinets, drill new holes through the cabinet and wall where the anchors will go, remove the cabinets from the walls, install the anchors, reinstall the cabinets and screw them into the anchors.

 

All of the above is predicated on calculating where to drill the holes in each cabinet to line up with a stud so that both cabinets will fit perfectly next to each other on the wall. So if I have to calculate those two holes in each cabinet, it is alot easier to just calculate the other four holes in each cabinet to use the mollys again.

 

Now ReMark's idea of using the paper is a great idea, but requires a little finesse. Both pieces of paper must be lined up perfectly to each other over the holes as if I was using the cabinets themselves. I'd be using the same tape measure and level but the pieces of paper will be the size of the outside of the cabinets which I then have to drill inside the cabinets. The anchor board at the top inside of the cabinet is only attached with spray glue to the back of the cabinet. Drilling from the backside of the cabinets could push it loose and I don't want to risk that. I could use pieces of paper the size of the inside of the cabinets, but then I'd only need to calculate how far apart to put them while leveling them and taping them to the wall. Like I said, a little finesse.

 

All in all, it still seems easier to simply use measurements and calculations to pre-drill the holes one time. It is taking considerably longer to figure out how to use the software, but I think it will be worth it in the end. Plus, if another layout problem comes up (such as patio, garden, fence, etc.), I'll be halfway through the learning curve.

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There is one more thing to take into consideration. I have no help installing the cabinets. There is no one to help hold up cabinets while I make markings.

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