mep / revit

[chrismof3330]

Dont know if Im being a bit but is revit and MEP the same program

[ReMark]

I could see where it could be confusing. There is AutoCAD MEP and then there is AutoCAD Revit MEP Suite. There has to be some difference between the two. Visit the AutoDesk website and read the descriptions for both.

[Jack_O'neill]

Revit is broken up into several specialized packages. MEP is one, and there's Architecture and Structure too. Lets folks concentrate on thier own trade without having to fool with stuff they are never going to do.

[ReMark]

A brief description of both as appears on the AutoDesk website:

 

AutoCAD® MEP software is the version of AutoCAD® software for mechanical, electrical, and plumbing (MEP) designers and drafters. Experience more accurate drafting and documentation of building systems in a familiar AutoCAD environment. Automated drafting tasks and interference detection helps you increase productivity and reduce errors. Support building systems design during construction and throughout the project lifecycle with authentic, reliable DWG™ technology.

 

AutoCAD® Revit® MEP Suite combines AutoCAD® MEP and Autodesk® Revit® MEP software. It’s one solution that supports both AutoCAD®-based workflows and Building Information Modeling (BIM) for mechanical, electrical, and plumbing (MEP) design professionals.

Use the AutoCAD Revit MEP Suite to more accurately and efficiently design building systems with tools for drafting, design, analysis, and documentation.

[tzframpton]

Dont know if Im being a bit but is revit and MEP the same program

Revit has three different "categories" that have trade-specific tools for each distinct version. Revit Architecutre, Revit MEP, and Revit Structure.

 

There is also different categories of AutoCAD as well. AutoCAD Architecture, AutoCAD MEP, plus a few others. Revit and AutoCAD are completely different CAD applications but Autodesk sells them together in a package deal as a software suite.

[chrismof3330]

Thanks for the prompt reply

[Jacko93]

I would just like to warn you that Revit MEP catalogues are currently nowhere near where they need to be content wise. I'm talking from UK experience though and I know that East Coast CAD are working closely with Autodesk US in order to rectify this, I have no idea where they are at with it though, but speaking with plenty of experience, don't hold your breath.

[chrismof3330]

Thank mate

[Jeff H]

AutoCad Arch and AutoCAD MEP is just AutoCAD customized using ObjectArx/OMF so it is basiclly AutoCAD extended with custom Objects and added functionality.

Instead of taking some geometry and creating a block to represent say a door AEC(Arch) uses a door object with door properties like width, number of doors etc.... that will anchor to a wall object.

 

When you think of Revit remind yourself it was created by a totally different company and Autodesk bought it out.

Just take a sharpie and cross the name and rename it something else.

 

You need to seperate them and think of them like one is a Mac and one is Windows.

 

What they have in common is they are broken up in packages MEP(Mechanical Electrical Plumbing) and Architechture that is it.

 

There is no 'zombie' objects in Revit.

In revit you create everthing from a template.

All objects you use or create when you send to another user act the same and the functions just like you created it.

So great everthing is smart and knows how to coordinate and everything wonderful if you do nothing but design generic basic non-custom, type designs.

 

The more things are required to know about each other and required to follow rules the more coupled the objects are.

[Jack_O'neill]

AutoCad Arch and AutoCAD MEP is just AutoCAD customized using ObjectArx/OMF so it is basiclly AutoCAD extended with custom Objects and added functionality.

Instead of taking some geometry and creating a block to represent say a door AEC(Arch) uses a door object with door properties like width, number of doors etc.... that will anchor to a wall object.

 

When you think of Revit remind yourself it was created by a totally different company and Autodesk bought it out.

Just take a sharpie and cross the name and rename it something else.

 

You need to seperate them and think of them like one is a Mac and one is Windows.

 

What they have in common is they are broken up in packages MEP(Mechanical Electrical Plumbing) and Architechture that is it.

 

There is no 'zombie' objects in Revit.

In revit you create everthing from a template.

All objects you use or create when you send to another user act the same and the functions just like you created it.

So great everthing is smart and knows how to coordinate and everything wonderful if you do nothing but design generic basic non-custom, type designs.

 

The more things are required to know about each other and required to follow rules the more coupled the objects are.

 

That's not entirely accurate my friend. You can draw anything you want in Revit. Any roof line, any window or configuration, any furniture, landscaping...anything you wish. You can also save it and use it again. Make your own siding, paving patterns, etc. The trick is knowing how to do it. It is very different than drawing in autocad. The learning curve is quite steep and the more Autocad experience you have, the more it will get in your way simply because it does behave so differently. There are a great many "templates" as you called them to use, but you are not restricted to them. You can create your own at will.

 

The generic designs that come with it are there to show you what's possible. You're not stuck with them in Revit any more than you are the primitive shapes in Autocad.

[Jeff H]

This is coming from a purely electrical perspective.

 

You can draw whatever you want in Revit but it is 100 times quicker in AutoCAD.

But when using Revit they are going to want you to model it.

 

Todays job a building full of current Regulators that feed a bunch of underground duct banks that feed airfield lighting.

Can you model a current regulator that takes to two connections one for each end of a wire(airfield lighting is in seris) and keep up with length voltage drop etc.....

AutoCAD MEP can.

Without a hack or faking it, you cannot model a switch bank(A box with more than one light switch) in Revit MEP.

 

By your reply it is obvious you are more on the architecture side, which I do not know much about except Revit is more geared and friendly to you guys.

As long as they have you guys using it then the MEP guys have no choice if a Revit job is needed.

[Jack_O'neill]

This is coming from a purely electrical perspective.

 

You can draw whatever you want in Revit but it is 100 times quicker in AutoCAD.

But when using Revit they are going to want you to model it.

 

Todays job a building full of current Regulators that feed a bunch of underground duct banks that feed airfield lighting.

Can you model a current regulator that takes to two connections one for each end of a wire(airfield lighting is in seris) and keep up with length voltage drop etc.....

AutoCAD MEP can.

Without a hack or faking it, you cannot model a switch bank(A box with more than one light switch) in Revit MEP.

 

By your reply it is obvious you are more on the architecture side, which I do not know much about except Revit is more geared and friendly to you guys.

As long as they have you guys using it then the MEP guys have no choice if a Revit job is needed.

 

I never said it was easier,,,I said you could do it! You can walk up the mountain barefooted too, but it's a lot easier in boots! And yes, I have Revit Architecture. Don't know anything about MEP. Most of my business is commercial curtainwall, some residential stuff and the occasional bit of tool and die. I live and die in AutoCAD, have been trying to learn Revit because I get asked about it from time to time. Like it or not, it seems that a lot of my industry is moving that direction.

 

As I said, I don't know anything about MEP, but in Architecture if you need a custom bit of say, office furniture, you create a "family" either in place or as a Standard Component Family. In place families are unique to the current project, Standard Component Families are saved as a separate RFA and can be loaded into any project. I haven't done much of that yet, so I may find in the future that there is something it won't let me do but so far, I've been able to create anything I needed that didn't already exist.

[Jeff H]

I said you could do it! .

Changing that to someone else could do it would be more correct.

 

I have little need or just no time to look at it but I have some Revit Arch resources if you want to look at it.

Need to check first if I can post publicly.

The MEP side of it is pretty good.

 

Thanks Jack,

for the replies maybe I need to quit complaining and learn it better.

[Jack_O'neill]

Changing that to someone else could do it would be more correct.

 

I have little need or just no time to look at it but I have some Revit Arch resources if you want to look at it.

Need to check first if I can post publicly.

The MEP side of it is pretty good.

 

Thanks Jack,

for the replies maybe I need to quit complaining and learn it better.

 

How about we say "it can be done"? Not sure I could do it either. I've gone through some of the tutorials, even drawn a small house in it on my own. That was interesting. When the time permits, I try to do whatever I'm working on in Autocad in Revit as well. I have found one thing it is particularly good at...drawing floor plans. I find myself doing that in revit, adding the doors and windows and what have you, then exporting that to Autocad. Saves a ton of time even though I have to go around and fix all the layers but that's ok. I can draw the floor plan in less than half the time it takes in Autocad.

 

What sort of switch bank were you looking to model? Is there a particular example I could get dimensions on? I'll play around with it and see what I can come up with.

[Jeff H]

Maybe I worded it wrong.

 

It is not the modeling, is easy to create building connections(Simple Example: Transformer attached to wall with offset for clearence), but the system connections being correctly tied to the building connections( Making the transformer a 3 Phase 240/120 delta system with 208 stinger)---which is common enough to need it.

 

So it is not the modeling it is your B phase is 208V to ground and you cannot set one up in revit

 

As a another simple example it is easy to model the switch bank but the one electrical connector limitation is the hassle.

 

If this makes sense it is no problem model it, but a hassle to make each individual switch be connected to a set of lights.

[Jack_O'neill]

Maybe I worded it wrong.

 

It is not the modeling, is easy to create building connections(Simple Example: Transformer attached to wall with offset for clearence), but the system connections being correctly tied to the building connections( Making the transformer a 3 Phase 240/120 delta system with 208 stinger)---which is common enough to need it.

 

So it is not the modeling it is your B phase is 208V to ground and you cannot set one up in revit

 

As a another simple example it is easy to model the switch bank but the one electrical connector limitation is the hassle.

 

If this makes sense it is no problem model it, but a hassle to make each individual switch be connected to a set of lights.

 

Ok, now I get it. That would be a problem. I'll ask around, got a couple of friends that think Revit is the be all and end all of drafting software. If they have anything to offer, I'll let you know.

[blackeagle1245]

what about the work flow ? is it the same in mep and revit?. What advantages does revit have?.

[tzframpton]

what about the work flow ? is it the same in mep and revit?. What advantages does revit have?.

The workflow in AutoCAD MEP vs Revit MEP are similar, and by that I mean AutoCAD MEP has simulated a lot of Revit's workflow and procedures, however since it's still AutoCAD you can still use 2D tools and normal "AutoCAD" functions. The advantages for Revit are enormous depending on your goal with your model. Since everything is housed within one file, the use of Views is the huge advantage over AutoCAD MEP.

[dumfatnhappy]

ok you lost me on this one as MEP is (can be) one model (many xref's if you're smart about it) and then you cut your sections and create views that you drop into your sheet files (all through 'project navigator').

 

still not sold that Revit is the bom (yet)

[tzframpton]

ok you lost me on this one as MEP is (can be) one model (many xref's if you're smart about it) and then you cut your sections and create views that you drop into your sheet files (all through 'project navigator').

No, that is false. You have multiple *.DWG files where as in Revit, you have a single *.RVT file.

 

still not sold that Revit is the bom (yet)

That's what everyone says until they actually use it. Including me.