Why autocad rather than a parametric prog ?

[DBenz]

Hi,
It appears there is a difference between autocad and progs like Catia, ProEngineer, Solidworks etc...they allow a change of dimension and the part and related items change accordingly unlike autocad, they also have better 3D capabilities perhaps ? What are the advantages of autocad still over these more recent progs or is it all to do with the subject matter one is creating ? In other words why do people use autocad when these other progs can do autocad and more ...or can they ? For someone starting out in the cad world is it now best to think anew, ...should someone part way into learning autocad change direction now if interested in recreating existing aircraft and vintage vehicles, generating plans of such for publication, perhaps also doing work for flight sims and so on ?
DBenz

[Cad Sponge]

We still use autocad because its universal. 90% of all design and drafting agencies use autodesk products. Autocad is also very versatile. If I want to draw a boat, or a skyscraper, I can do it in the same program. I couldn't do that in solidworks, etc.

[PS_Port]

I believe as you stated, that it all has to do with the subject matter.
Architects - will use an architectural product ...Revit, ADT etc.
Structural - Revit structure, Strucad etc..
Civil Guys - Civil3d, 12D etc
Mechanical - Some HVAC prog.
Steel detailers - Prosteel, or sim.

The list is endless.. but with the versatility of Autocad you can do all of the above....not with the same efficiency as specifically designed software.

Basically Autocad doesn't limit you to one field. :)

[JD Mather]

No vanilla AutoCAD here http://students4.autodesk.com

[rustysilo]

The biggest thing in my mind is exactly this:

90% of all design and drafting agencies use autodesk products.
For us here in Jerksonville the city and local utility use AutoCAD so we pretty much have to as well. Of course the D.O.T. uses Microstation in most every state.
In the future I see Autodesk losing a lot of ground to competition, especially in the open source market. It will take several years, but open source cadd products are starting to hit the inet and once they begin to catch on we'll see a revolution in the cadd world. Autodesk will have to work hard to keep up and they'll have to pay particular attention to their customers demands and learn to treat them with more respect than what they have shown in the past.

[Lazer]

I use both Autocad and Inventor, If I need a quick drawing I will knock it up using autocad, however when we design something I use Inventor.

Autocad will always have it's place in the CAD world:wink:

[Cad Sponge]

I agree rusty, I hate the corporate pirate monopolizing *******s at Autodesk more than anyone in the world, I can guarantee that. But you know what? Even though I hate Autodesk with every ounce of my soul, I still use their products every day, because of the reasons listed above. I would really love to see a report of Autodesk's profit margins. I guarantee that its over 75%. For 5,000$ and the 15 hours it took to write Autocad. I expect this program to wipe my ass, but it never does.

Edit: Lazer, your signature is blasphemy, but so true!

[StykFacE]

Hi,
It appears there is a difference between autocad and progs like Catia, ProEngineer, Solidworks etc...they allow a change of dimension and the part and related items change accordingly unlike autocad, they also have better 3D capabilities perhaps ? What are the advantages of autocad still over these more recent progs or is it all to do with the subject matter one is creating ?
You are thinking of 3D mechanical parts. This is a totally other type of CAD work. AutoCAD does a way better job than the listed programs in the 2D department, tenfold.


For us here in Jerksonville the city and local utility use AutoCAD so we pretty much have to as well. Of course the D.O.T. uses Microstation in most every state.
In the future I see Autodesk losing a lot of ground to competition, especially in the open source market. It will take several years, but open source cadd products are starting to hit the inet and once they begin to catch on we'll see a revolution in the cadd world.

Well, here's the problem with the open-source market. They are a great free or little cost advantage, but they are not the standard and this will scare people and companies away, and lack the full support and warranties that business' want. AutoCAD is still the #1 tool used in college and degree plans, plus once something is the "standard" it's hard to stray. I could go to my boss right now, and give an entire spill on a new CAD software that will save tons of money, still be effecient, and won't have any compatibility problems with other companies, and he wouldn't do it. Take Microsoft as an example. There have been numerous alternatives along the years to it, and even more today with Linux becoming popular. But it will never outweigh the giant that Microsoft is, and that can virtually be stated as a fact. Same goes for Autodesk/AutoCAD.

There might be a revolution within the underground, or very small companies, but on a large scale I don't see anybody in the near or distant future that can come into this league of design and skoot Autodesk from their 1st place seat. It's not impossible, but highly unlikely. You have to remember, as soon as another company makes something "better" than Autodesk, then the team at Autodesk will catch on very quickly and do what they need to make things better.

I love AutoCAD and wouldn't trade it for any other program for what I do. And anything that doesn't work perfectly or effeciently I can program it to do so, if I wanted to take the time to learn it. :)

[SLW210]

Autodesk offers plenty of Industry specific apps.

[DavidB]

maybe off subject but what is Vanilla autocad??

No vanilla AutoCAD here http://students4.autodesk.com (http://students4.autodesk.com/)

[StykFacE]

maybe off subject but what is Vanilla autocad??
the term "Vanilla" refers to the "plain jane" version of AutoCAD. :)

[rustysilo]

Well, here's the problem with the open-source market. They are a great free or little cost advantage, but they are not the standard and this will scare people and companies away, and lack the full support and warranties that business' want. AutoCAD is still the #1 tool used in college and degree plans, plus once something is the "standard" it's hard to stray. I could go to my boss right now, and give an entire spill on a new CAD software that will save tons of money, still be effecient, and won't have any compatibility problems with other companies, and he wouldn't do it. Take Microsoft as an example. There have been numerous alternatives along the years to it, and even more today with Linux becoming popular. But it will never outweigh the giant that Microsoft is, and that can virtually be stated as a fact. Same goes for Autodesk/AutoCAD.
Good point.

There might be a revolution within the underground, or very small companies, but on a large scale I don't see anybody in the near or distant future that can come into this league of design and skoot Autodesk from their 1st place seat. It's not impossible, but highly unlikely. You have to remember, as soon as another company makes something "better" than Autodesk, then the team at Autodesk will catch on very quickly and do what they need to make things better.
Yeah, like buy them up and put the Autodesk name on the product(s).:lol:

[StykFacE]

haha, I know right? 8)

[JD Mather]

I might also point out that AutoCAD, AutoCAD Mechanical and Mechanical Desktop come free on the Autodesk Inventor disks. Autodesk Inventor costs about $1,300 USD more than vanilla AutoCAD depending on where in the world you are located.

This helps for those who are trained on AutoCAD while they make the transition to Inventor.

And Inventor LT is free for download in some parts of the world.
http://labs.autodesk.com

[rustysilo]

It is similar with Civil 3D which comes with the Land Desktop/Civil Design Companion and Map all for "free".

[JD Mather]

It is similar with Civil 3D which comes with the Land Desktop/Civil Design Companion and Map all for "free".

I'm not familiar with those programs, but aren't they all vertical apps built on top of AutoCAD?

Inventor is stand-alone and not built on top of AutoCAD in any way although it will read/write dwg if needed.

[rustysilo]

Yeah. I didn't know Inventor was a stand-alone product. Never used it.

[Cad Sponge]

yea it irritates me, inventor is more like solidworks, than autocad.

[JD Mather]

... inventor is more like solidworks, than autocad.

Thank goodness, AutoCAD is a mess.

[az101010]

funny how they said the drafting
table was the standard and drawing
lines on a computer screen and
printing them out won't amount
to a "hill of beans".. same mentality
said DOS was the standard and no
amount of windows "eye candy"
will change that..

it didn't matter what microsoft
told them..

now autodesk is telling drafters that
a "real" computer program for making
buildings is now fully developed and
it is time to dump the old 1982 based
line drawing program..

some people don't want to learn
something new so they blind themselves
to the reality of it..

but yeah- parametric is what a modern
computer can do.. and if all you want to
do is keep drawing lines on a screen-
then all you need is one of those 1980s
processors- and also very soon you will
be out of business..

[f700es]

As for open source, which I have no problem with, but I have yet to see anything even close to what I can do in AutoCAD. I guess they need more than 15 hours to code their apps :wink:
As for Linux, 10 years later they still cannot make that break into the desktop market. Even with Dell selling Linux boxes for the last 3+ years they still are not being taken serious. Even the good Linux apps that make any headway are the ones that have Win32 ports, Gimp, OpenOffice, Inkscape, Scribus and so on. Too many variables in Linux, does use RPM files to install, do you want to run KDE, Gnome or Xfce.
IMHO as always :wink:

[fuccaro]

These days I rarely use AutoCAD. Other programs come with advantages. To draw parametric is a good thing. But I think that AutoCAD is the best 2D tool.
And also when AutoCAD doesn't offers me a tool for a specific task, I quickly skech a simple Lisp routine to speed up my work.

[az101010]

before they started "drawing" things TO BE built-
they just built them at the direction of the
builder/designer.. now we are back to just
building it and not drawing it first- (virtually)..

but people who have been drawing on the
computer screen for the last 15 years- or
the drawing table for the last 100- can't
imagine how you build something without
drawing it first..

a good way to start learning to do this
would be to build a bird house with no drawings..
if you don't like the shape of the roof- just
take it off and build a new one- and do that
with everything on the little house until you
get it all the way you want it..

then learn a parametric virtual construction
program and do it the same way..

no drawing involved..

after you're done- the program will automatically
produce instructions for the builders to build it..

and the biggest advantage for doing it this
way is- it's more fun- not to mention saving
a lot of money and getting to see exactly
what it looks like and how it works before
it's actually built..

gee what a great idea for building things-
why didn't i think of that..http://www.cadtutor.net/forum/images/icons/icon6.gif