Large Point Clouds

Hey!

I have a pretty big point cloud (around 10 million points) that I want to create a surface from. I can do it in Civil, with more or less ease - but I am wondering what other programs are out there that can handle this size of point cloud? And can create a workable surface from it?

TIA!

AutoCAD 2014 can work with point clouds but I don't know what the limitation might be.

I have assumed that AutoCAD is no better at it than Civil 3D - since they're based on the same platform.

But you used the words "more or less ease". Isn't that good? Was there a problem of any kind?

Okey, the deal is that Civil can't display more than 1.5 million points, and it can't create a surface from points that isn't displayed.

I can zoom in on a part of the point cloud, refresh everything so I can display all the points in that area, create a smaller surface on just that group of points and then repeat this all over the surface - but for me this is not a good enough solution.

I have tried ReCap and Infraworks and both of those programs can import the pointcloud and display it beautifully - but as far as I can see, none of the programs can create a surface.

So the question remains: are there other programs out there that can handle more than 1.5 million points (upto and above 10 million points) and create a surface based on all those points.

I also know (and agree with) that the surface created with only 1.5 million points are in most cases enough detailed to work with - but that is not the question either.

Now I understand. Thanks for the explanation. Maybe ArcGIS?

Civil 3D cannot handle overhangs or vertical surfaces and although it looks as if it has meshed them all together it has joined the points incorrectly. We had a great deal of trouble modelling up a river with its walls and cappings in C3D. The file size in C3D for a DTM created from 10 million points is going to be enormous.

If you are dealing with so many points you need to look at software from the laser scanning companies, such as kubit, Faro, Trimble, etc. They can create surfaces in way but I don't think that they can do it en mass like C3D does when creating a DTM.

Or look at a company that AutoDesk aquired last year called AllPoint Systems.

http://allpointsystems.com/solutions.php

Divide and conquer?

If you were to split into multiples can you then join multiple surfaces? Just guessing here, I've never worked with point clouds and do very little with surfaces.

Er, nevermind.

Thanks all!

Patrick, yeah the divide-and-conquer-technique is where I am at right now, and that will have to be good enough - the purchase of a GEO-program for this one task is not really feasible.

In my opinion, point clouds are a nightmare regardless of the software program used. The marketing brochures/videos of all of the laser scanners and point cloud software makes point clouds look amazing The reality is very different though.

but I am wondering what other programs are out there that can handle this size of point cloud? And can create a workable surface from it?

TIA!

There is lots of point cloud software that can easily handle 10 million points. The challenge is getting a useful surface that can be exported to AutoCad or another design package and used (some will create meshes within them although not allow you to export the surfaces etc).

Surfaces are the 'easy' part of point clouds. The harder part is getting anything more useful than a natural surface out of a point cloud. E.g. if you go scan a building face, it all looks good and a nice 3D representation when you are zoomed out and looking at the distance from far. Zoom in on a column or something and you will see thousands of points that makes it hard to distinguish anything.

Many point cloud programs require you to trace the point cloud manually to put in objects. E.g. the software cannot recognise it as a column and make a 3D cylinder; you have to trace over it yourself (open to user error) and draw a cylinder in effect (of if in 2D, trace the outline etc). We have a entry entry laser scanner (was still about 100K) and it scans okay, although the software just doesn't seem to be on the market yet that can work to the true capacity of laser scanners.

If money was no issue, Leica 'Cyclone' software (at approximately 40K for a license) is the current market leader. That still requires a lot of office work to get a laser scan into a useful form. The time saved in the field greatly increases the office time.

The one use laser scanning does have is for earthworks (including mining) surveys and structural deformation monitoring.

AutoCAD 2014 can work with point clouds but I don't know what the limitation might be.

It is terrible. Yes, it can read a point cloud although the point cloud is then 'dumb'. You can do basically nothing useful at all with it. Autodesk should not have even bothered to implement it in its current form.

I have assumed that AutoCAD is no better at it than Civil 3D - since they're based on the same platform.

Civil 3D is better and has more features for working with point clouds. It is still relatively useless though if you want to do anything more than try to create a natural surface. From the sounds of what you are tying to do, Civil 3D is your best bet (especially if it is for a one off job). As someone else mentioned you will just have to break your data up into sub datasets.

I have tried ReCap and Infraworks and both of those programs can import the pointcloud and display it beautifully - but as far as I can see, none of the programs can create a surface.

You've just described many of the point cloud software programs on the market. Nice pretty pictures although not a whole lot else in terms of functionality for survey/engineering purposes.

kubit

I've trialled this one and wasn't impressed with it.