Jump to content
nmoxey

Autodesk Civil 3d 2009 vs Carlson Civil Suite 2009

Recommended Posts

nmoxey

I know this is a touchy subject, but the company I work for is currently using a mix of Land Desktop Development 2004 and Carlson Civil Suite 2009. We are looking to upgrade our Land Desktop Development to either Civil 3d 2009 or Carlson Civil Suite 2009 and I was wondering if I could get some input from the members to the pros and cons of each program.

 

Our company is a civil engineering company that does alot of commercial and residential subdivision development. Any input would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rustysilo

I've never used any program outside of Autodesk products so I have no idea about Carlson. I recently saw a post about MicroSurvey at theswamp. It looks like it might be another option to consider as well. Uses Intellicad so it should be similar to AutoCAD which cuts down on the learning curve.

 

We have Civil 3D and I love it although it has some quirks here and there. It is similar enough to Land Desktop/Civil Design, but is dynamic in nature so no more rebuilding surfaces, then rebuilding profiles, etc. You make a change to your surface data, the surface updates, the profiles update, etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
BIGAL

As an ex dealer for another brand of surveying engineering software I would have to say that there is some better software out there to do surveying and engineering functions vastly simpler than Civ3D and often with more detail.

 

The trade off though is the CAD drawing side even though they have spent a lot of time improving there cad ability.

 

I would expect the majority of engineers etc here in Australia have two packages Autocad and something else.

 

Yes we run Civ3D but we run the Australian ARD on top of it to make it equal to what we were used to. ie two packages. What I am trying to say is that add ons to Autocad can only make it better and fill in holes in the original product.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rkmcswain

P&P Sheet production is in it's infancy in Carlson, but Carlson's modeling of roads and intersections, etc. is far beyond C3D.

 

The best thing to do is get together a sampling of your daily tasks and ask Carlson to demonstrate how to do them in Carlson. They will either come to your office or do a Webinar for you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rustysilo

And I bet you wouldn't have to deal with a subscription using Carlson...

 

What makes their roadway modeling so much better than C3D if you don't mind me asking?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rkmcswain
And I bet you wouldn't have to deal with a subscription using Carlson...

 

Carlson does have a similar model, but the costs are very reasonable.

 

What makes their roadway modeling so much better than C3D if you don't mind me asking?

 

Specifically, intersection design. You don't need all those alignments like you do in C3D. I'm pretty sure they have some demo videos you can watch on their website if you are interested.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rustysilo

Downloading one now. Thanks for the info. I see the cost is a bit less expensive that Civil 3D. I've seen that there are a few intersection add-ons for C3D that are supposed to make it a bit easier, well not that it's hard to model an intersection in C3D. Just a little time consuming due to all the alignments and profiles.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rustysilo

Wow! It does the intersections for you! That's pretty cool.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
sinc

I was talking with some surveyors at a seminar today, and they said they finally dropped C3D and switched to Carlson. They said they've been far, far happier and more-productive since doing that.

 

They said it's much easier for them to "work with others" now. They said they can even extract data from Civil-3D files. Meanwhile, they had a lot of issues in this regard with C3D. The other big problem they had with C3D was the constant crashing. Not sure what they're talking about. o:)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rustysilo

Yeah sure you don't.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gravytrain

I have worked with "Autodesk" software for years.....way back when it was called "softdesk". I have worked for 10 plus years using AutoCAD with Eagle Point software. I have also used both LDD and Civil 3D over the past couple of years.......and then I got the chance to try Carlson Civil 2008 and I was blown away on what they had. For years I had been complaining to Eagle Point about the lack "newer & better" software.......with very little change seen. Don't get me wrong, Eagle Point with AutoCAD is a good software, but not the best. Civil 3D changed things when it finally introduced the ability to make changes automatic and update everything at once.....although not as easy as they like to speak about, it did work. But then I got the chance to use Carlson Civil 2008 on a subdivision project and could not believe how simple they made it. FINALLY......someone out there gets it!! When working with subdivisions......intersections, cul-de-sacs, knuckles, and even roundabouts are a huge part of the design, not to mention turn lanes. Carlson Civil has made the disign of these items take only minutes, not hours or days like with Civil 3D or other software........it's all automatic and super easy. I would go to the Carlson website and download a "full use" trial version of it or even watch some of their "FREE" webinares that show you how it works. Carlson Civil 2008 or 2009 is the best software on the market in my opinion.......I wish more Civil 3D users had the chance to try it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gravytrain

I see that a lot if not most users of LDD are making the move to Civil 3D and I am wondering why?

 

Is it just that Autodesk is forcing them to switch with them no longer going to support LDD (or offer it at all)? I'm confused as to why so many firms out there are blindly switching to Civil 3D just because they think that everyone else is so they better do it too.

 

Now is when a firm needs to look at other options and not just be the typical "follower". There are other options out there......and they can still use the "standard" cad platform of AutoCad! I have spoken to several firms and was told that they are switching or will be switching from LDD to Civil 3D "ONLY" because they are basiclly being forced to by Autodesk.....no other reason, and 95% of them have never even looked at the option of switching to something else.....that I can't believe. You would think, if they had to switch programs that at least they would look to see what other software was out there, maybe finding something that works better for them.....maybe not, but at least take a little time and see.

 

Why is this happening?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rustysilo

Because all the little Autodesk demons have their grasp on the market.:twisted:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rkmcswain
I see that a lot if not most users of LDD are making the move to Civil 3D and I am wondering why?

 

Why is this happening?

 

Some thoughts...

 

1) If you have a lot of users who have been using LDT for many years, then migrating them to C3D is going to be easier than to Carlson.

2) If you have many seats of LDT, you probably upgraded to C3D a long time ago (when it was free-to-cheap) - even if you kept using LDT. This is a big investment to just throw away.

3) Last I checked, it cost $$ per-seat to downgrade C3D (or LDT) to Map or ACAD. I know Carlson runs on C3D or LDT, but if the goal is to drop those packages, why would you want all that overhead loaded?

4) Carlson's sheet creation is light-years behind C3D. Many clients still have a deliverable requirement of plan and profile sheets. You can do all the design you want, but you don't get paid until sheets are delivered.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gravytrain

Civil 3D and LDD are not even close to being the same product. Switching from one to the other is no more easier than switching to some other software and if you think they are the same.......your crazy. I understand for those firms that carry a subscription........changing may not be an option, but for those who don't, than changing is an option.

 

I'm not sure if I would say that civil 3D plan & profile sheets are that far ahead of Carlson, I have used both, but what I do know is that no other software on the market compares to Carlson Civil 2009 when it comes to subdivision layout and street design. They have made it simple......Civil 3D is not that hard, but is very time consuming when it comes to intersections, knuckles, cul-de-sacs, roundabouts and turn lanes and that more than makes up for the sheets. Watch some of the webinars they provide (for free) and you will see what I mean. Carlson even offers hydrology.....something Civil 3D doesn't offer. Carlson offers super "real" support (for free).....and they never stop offering support for a product they put out.....unlike with Autodesk. Don't get me wrong......I'm a huge AutoCad fan and have been using it for 20 years......I just think that when it comes to speed (time is money) Carlson is easier and faster.......not to mention a lot cheaper! Carlson has been around for the past 25 years.....they too know what they are doing......don't be a follower!!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rustysilo

Switching from Land Desktop to Civil 3D was more or less a breeze for me once I understood the differences in how they work.

 

There are tools you can get to make doing intersections, etc. quicker.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
rkmcswain
Civil 3D and LDD are not even close to being the same product.
I never said they were.
Switching from one to the other is no more easier than switching to some other software
Of course it is. Going from LDT to C3D, the workflow is very similar and the terminology is virtually the same. Remember, I didn't say it was easy, only easier.

 

 

I'm not sure if I would say that civil 3D plan & profile sheets are that far ahead of Carlson, I have used both, but what I do know is that no other software on the market compares to Carlson Civil 2009 when it comes to subdivision layout and street design. They have made it simple......Civil 3D is not that hard, but is very time consuming when it comes to intersections, knuckles, cul-de-sacs, roundabouts and turn lanes and that more than makes up for the sheets.

You are mixing apples and bananas. I never said that layout and design were more difficult in Carlson. In fact, I said just the opposite in this very thread.

 

Read more carefully. Taking a finished design and creating P&P sheets is virtually impossible in Carlson for us. I was at the Carlson User Conference, I saw the demo, I asked the questions, and it was clear that this part of the software is way behind even LDT.

 

Watch some of the webinars they provide (for free) and you will see what I mean.

See above.

 

Carlson even offers hydrology.....something Civil 3D doesn't offer. Carlson offers super "real" support (for free).....and they never stop offering support for a product they put out.....unlike with Autodesk.

I never argued any of these points, although some hydro is available for C3D.

 

Carlson is easier and faster.......not to mention a lot cheaper!
A common myth.

Civil 3D retail = $7495

Carlson suite (3500) + AutoCAD (4000) = $7500

 

Carlson has been around for the past 25 years.....

 

Yes I know, I was there for 4 of them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
tzframpton
Yes I know, I was there for 4 of them.

And a walk-off home run with that quote. :wink:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gravytrain

your are trying to confuse the others.......plain and simple. No way no how does Civil 3D even come close to Carlson when it comes to intersections and what not...........gp ahead, buy the add on software that makes it easier to use Civil 3d....that makes it better. Whatever makes you feel better.

 

Face it ........if you used Civil 3D 2009 verse Carlson Civil 2009 (alone) there would be no comparison. I simply say that given the same subdivision design that I could complete the final design hours ahead of you using Civil 3D......no problem.

 

Give me a break.......are you trying to tell people that Civil 3D is cheaper than Carlson Civil Suite?........you must be kidding. You get three programs, civil, survey, hydrology, and gis with Carlson.......and you are wrong when you said that Civil 3D offers hydrology.....it does not.

 

Eagle point and Civil 3D are about the same when it comes to sheet set up, but clearly, civil 3D has a long way to go when it comes to subdivision design and general site design.......they are way behind.

 

Fool all that you want to......all they have to do is look at the webinars provided by Carlson to see what they offer......oh......too bad civil 3D doesn't offer the same!

 

In conclusion, if you want to be a typical follower and not a leader than by all accounts, use civil 3D.......be like all the rest.....a follower!!!!

 

If you want to produce CAD in a faster and easier format, than have a look at Carlson Civil.....you won't be wasting your time.

 

In the end......Civil 3D sucks and is a huge waste of money. Save time and waste by using Carlson Civil.......if you think I'm wrong, please, take the time to compare the two, you will be surprised!.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...