Getting upper Management to listen ???

[Patrick Hughes]

You know Daniel, it sounds like you are dealing with a management team/individual that inspite of itself is just imposing its "superiority" over you. Likely, they don't even realize that is what they are doing and have no clue that what they are doing results in crushing your spirit.

 

It is not fun, but there may be a way to manipulate the situation to your way. That is to become totally subservient to boost their ego. Find a way to make them think that your ideas are their ideas. The absolute last thing they want is to allow you to be seen as smarter then them. It means swallowing your pride and not getting the recognition for things. You can take satisfaction in knowing you outsmarted them.

 

I'm so glad I'm self unemployeed.

[DANIEL]

You know Daniel, it sounds like you are dealing with a management team/individual that inspite of itself is just imposing its "superiority" over you. Likely, they don't even realize that is what they are doing and have no clue that what they are doing results in crushing your spirit.

 

It is not fun, but there may be a way to manipulate the situation to your way. That is to become totally subservient to boost their ego. Find a way to make them think that your ideas are their ideas. The absolute last thing they want is to allow you to be seen as smarter then them. It means swallowing your pride and not getting the recognition for things. You can take satisfaction in knowing you outsmarted them.

 

I'm so glad I'm self unemployeed.

 

I feel like the guy from 300, only I don't look as good with out a shirt nor do I have a spear ......

 

your most likely right now that I've thought about it, wish I was self employed ... wait, self unemployed? lol

[Jack_O'neill]

As per your example, you claim "after being forced to by a client it cost them twice as much as it should have, just like I told them it would .....". But, did it really cost them anything at all to do it in that manner, might want to check with the bean counters what the cost to the company ACTUALLY was. Might have actually been a better deal.

 

That's why I said you'd need real, traceable data as to an impact to the bottom line. If you have a job coming up that is going to cost $5000 to do, but with a software or hardware upgrade it will only cost $2500, that sounds like you've saved 50%. However if it costs $10,000 for the upgrade, your job cost actually went up by 100%..IF you based it only on that job. Its all about how fast you can pay back the investment and then start saving the company money. You'll need to tie it savings on work you do now, not on potential jobs that you might attract if you have this ability. Increasing accuracy is something you can mention, but since they expect you to do it right now that might not help much. The "it will make this error impossible' countered with "if you'd pay attention, it wouldn't happen now" conversation will only go down hill from there.

 

For instance, many moons ago I was pushing to replace a pen plotter with an inkjet. The pen plotter we had was paid for, and the inkjet I wanted was $6000. I approached the plant manager with the idea and his only words of advice were "if you can justify it with hard data, we'll buy it tomorrow". Now for those of you to young to remember pen plotters, this particular one was a serial device that was state of the art in 1984. Best one on the market, but it had no buffer, so it kept your computer occupied during the entire plot. Even after we moved to windows, there was no way to avoid it. If you tabbed out or even let the screen saver kick in, the plotter would stop. So, for 30 to 45 minutes you found something else to do like catching up on filing or whatever. This inkjet plotter had it's own memory buffer and could be configured as a windows system plotter. Send the drawing and go back to work. I used this as the justification. By the time we'd plotted 800 drawings at our labor rate, we'd burned enough labor to pay for the inkjet plotter. Plotting time was cut from 30-45 min to a minute and a half for a d size sheet. We could buy roll paper instead of cut sheets, a further savings. Plus even then (this was 1993, the pen plotter was 9 years old) plotter pens that fit it had gone out of business. So had the company that made it, so parts were going to become an issue, let alone drivers for future upgrades. Got that all typed up, filled out a purchase order and left it on his desk. He called and asked one question, and a week later our new plotter rolled in the back door.

 

Show real savings, a fast payback of investment, and you might win.

[BlackBox]

I've read some great articles on this by Mark Kiker (and others) that may be of help... I'll see if I can't dig some up, and post back links.

 

Here are some articles written over the past year that I found to be helpful in my situation, perhaps they can help you now:

 

CAD Management: Happy Old Year

 

CAD Management: Is Your Workspace Killing Productivity?

 

CAD Management: Dealing with a Horrible Boss

 

CAD Management: Horrible Bosses

 

CAD Management: Managing More Than Just CAD

 

CAD Management: Seeking Good Advice

 

CAD Management: New Employee Orientation

 

Sharing Information

 

Why People Bully (and what you need to do about it)

 

CAD Room Bullying

 

CAD Management: How to Impress Your Boss

 

 

 

** Edit to add - These also seem relevant:

 

CAD Management: Challenges

 

CAD Management: Challenges, Part 2

 

CAD Management: Agreements

 

CAD Management: A CAD Manager's Mindset, Part 3 (I haven't been able to locate parts 1 & 2 yet)

Edited February 8, 2012 by BlackBox

[DANIEL]

thats going to take a bit to get through Renderman lol but thanks

[Jack_O'neill]

[quote=Patrick Hughes;455548

I'm so glad I'm self unemployeed.

 

 

Amen brother! It's getting pretty slow around here, if things don't pick up soon I may be forced to seek employment elsewhere. If I do, I think I'll take a turn at truck driving....looked in the help wanted ads over the weekend...zero cad jobs....zero manufacturing jobs....25 jobs for somebody with a class A CDL.

[SLW210]

Texas is a right to work state so you'd be suprised at how easy it is to fire some one here, I suspect he's feeding someone lies but who knows for sure ... but I digress ... I definitely plan on starting some documentation as apperantly my word isnt good enough any more lol

 

as for what it actually cost the company to upgrade, they still had to get me to do it all for them so I saw everything, the price came out about the same actually do to a new corporate account with autodesk but we were short a copy of electrical and only got one subscription ...

 

You do not understand, right to work has nothing to do with it. That just means if you have a union, a person can work there and Not be in the union. You most likely mean "employment at will" which means you can quit or be fired at any time for any reason (not really true), any time, no notice, etc.. You can still be sued or accused of violating Federal employment laws (that costs money, win or lose). Florida and Tennessee are "employment at will" also. I got stories if you want to here them. It is always best to have documentation.

 

I went through all this on another thread somewhere. I have had courses on this, I think I still have example written warnings, etc. if you think you might need something.

 

As far as upgrade cost, I wasn't talking about actual cost, but HOW it was payed for (client request), might have been absorbed in the contract.

[BlackBox]

thats going to take a bit to get through Renderman lol but thanks

 

Just some light reading...

[DANIEL]

You do not understand, right to work has nothing to do with it. That just means if you have a union, a person can work there and Not be in the union. You most likely mean "employment at will" which means you can quit or be fired at any time for any reason (not really true), any time, no notice, etc.. You can still be sued or accused of violating Federal employment laws (that costs money, win or lose). Florida and Tennessee are "employment at will" also. I got stories if you want to here them. It is always best to have documentation.

 

I went through all this on another thread somewhere. I have had courses on this, I think I still have example written warnings, etc. if you think you might need something.

 

As far as upgrade cost, I wasn't talking about actual cost, but HOW it was payed for (client request), might have been absorbed in the contract.

 

thats interesting regarding the right to work stuff, they can handle the paper work, I just want them to listen to me when I tell them its someones time lol

 

the upgrades were costed to a job but it was taken out of the margin, the customer refused pay us for it.

[Dana W]

Amen brother! It's getting pretty slow around here' date=' if things don't pick up soon I may be forced to seek employment elsewhere. If I do, I think I'll take a turn at truck driving....looked in the help wanted ads over the weekend...zero cad jobs....zero manufacturing jobs....25 jobs for somebody with a class A CDL.[/quote']

 

They'll need new drivers to haul all those unanswered resumes to the mixed paper recycling center. About 200 of them are mine.

 

I just had a promising interview today. The person I talked to went out of his way to compliment me on being one of only two respondents out of 43 that bothered to include some sample drawing work with their resume.

 

I know, nearly off topic, but hey.

 

On second thought, those other applicants are probably 41 reasons some management people don't give our thoughts much thought, huh?

 

This is one of the best threads I have seen on this sight. Lots of insight here.

[DANIEL]

On second thought, those other applicants are probably 41 reasons some management people don't give our thoughts much thought, huh?

 

your probably right, I think its why they started letting me do the hiring, thinking back I was probably a shoe in as well with my samples, I just know that back when I first started with this company they kept hiring people that looked and sounded great, once they were all gone they started asking for my input lol. we still have a turn over rate though, of the three I most wanted to keep, one had a heart attack, one had a nervious break down and the other one left to become a highschool teacher .....

 

and I don't think ya'll are off topic at all.

[Jack_O'neill]

your probably right, I think its why they started letting me do the hiring, thinking back I was probably a shoe in as well with my samples, I just know that back when I first started with this company they kept hiring people that looked and sounded great, once they were all gone they started asking for my input lol. we still have a turn over rate though, of the three I most wanted to keep, one had a heart attack, one had a nervious break down and the other one left to become a highschool teacher .....

 

and I don't think ya'll are off topic at all.

 

Funny how things change. My wife is a kindergarten teacher who after 15 years plans not to return next year. Federal interference, paperwork, redtape and b.s. has caused her to finally get her fill and is looking for a new career in daycare management or something. I have a daughter who is an RN, and for similar reasons in the hospitals now teaches nursing at a local technical college. I'm seriously considering the truck driving thing...steady work, lots of demand, low stress. If I can drive a company truck for a few years, I'll be retirement age and can toss it all in. Nothing ever works out like we plan, does it?

[DANIEL]

Funny how things change. My wife is a kindergarten teacher who after 15 years plans not to return next year. Federal interference' date=' paperwork, redtape and b.s. has caused her to finally get her fill and is looking for a new career in daycare management or something. I have a daughter who is an RN, and for similar reasons in the hospitals now teaches nursing at a local technical college. I'm seriously considering the truck driving thing...steady work, lots of demand, low stress. If I can drive a company truck for a few years, I'll be retirement age and can toss it all in. Nothing ever works out like we plan, does it?[/quote']

 

I'm not sure I'd continue in this profession beyond my current employer, I'm really at a point where I want to become self employed some how, people laugh when I joke about running a taco truck but it ain't really a joke ........

 

and no, things usually turn out different than you expect, I went to school for graphic design and computer animation, I do niether lol

[Jack_O'neill]

I'm not sure I'd continue in this profession beyond my current employer, I'm really at a point where I want to become self employed some how, people laugh when I joke about running a taco truck but it ain't really a joke ........

 

and no, things usually turn out different than you expect, I went to school for graphic design and computer animation, I do niether lol

 

I have a dear friend that did just that Daniel. Well, not a taco shack, but a sub shop. She was a very successful electronic component salesman. The company we both worked at stressed her out so bad, she chucked it all in and opened the sub shop with her sister. Doing amazingly well too. If you hate your job to the point that every time you see your boss, crosshairs appear on his forehead, it's time for a new place to work. Yes, you have to make a living and there are things we have to put up with no matter what, but if its killing you, it's not worth it.

[DANIEL]

it's ahard committment to make with such an economy, maybe in a couple years when I free up some financial obligations ......

[Jack_O'neill]

She did it in 09, economy was about as rotten as it gets then. We had a bunch of the chain eateries die. There was a Shorty Smalls, a TGIFriday, a Smokey Bones, an O'Charleys and a Lonestar Steakhouse that all died within 2 months of each other and at about the same time she opened her shop. The shop she opened is in a little town just to the east of here, population of about 2500. She does some catering and has about 5 part time employees. Place stays packed. If you give them what they want, they will come.

[DANIEL]

she's brave lol

[Jack_O'neill]

she's brave lol

 

she is that...pity you can't meet her sometime. a real fireball. I had no doubt she'd make it succeed.

[jweigle]

Most if not all of us at one point in time in our careers have dealt with this situation.

 

My advice to you is this and its already been stated - Have all your information and statistics to back up your need or want, be prepared to handle the negativity that comes your way(have some form of heat reversal if necessary), and make a positive closing argument. Experiences will differ and more often than not I can at least document what I wanted fixed or aquired should the need for it come up again.

 

(i.e. How come we lost 3 workstations overnight? Well sir, you remember when I tried to lobby for those surge protectors and you said no because of the cost? Gotcha.)

 

At the end of the day though, I agree with Jack - you need to save your sanity. If you feel as if your workplace is looking more and more like a battlefield, I would be in the market looking to advance my career somewhere else because its not worth the extra drama.

[DANIEL]

my work is definitely a battle lol, which I don't mind, its the burocracy(I know I miss spelled it lol) that does me in .....