Aerodynamic efficiency??

[ricracer16]

Can solidworks determine aerodynamic efficiency? If not what progam can?

thanks,

[Coosbaylumber]

Yesterday there was a fellow at RCGroups (Builder's Workshop) wanting to know similar information. But, very basic too. I would suggest you see them there and contact him. For this ain't simple.

 

 

Wm.

[shift1313]

depending on which version you have you can use FloWorks for something that may work for you. I know there is design optimization for thermal analysis(which can directly relate to flow). Are you hoping to have SW modify your part to hit a certain Coeficient of drag?

[ricracer16]

Hey Shift,

No not even close. I don’t have any software yet; I was just asking because I wanted to make sure when I do get a program it does have something that I can work out some projects.

So far I have signed up for a beginner’s welder’s class in New York. It’s a basic course with metal shop access. So I’ll get the fundamentals down in the actual metal shop and hopefully this will give me some more ideas and help me figure out what I have already.

I had some basic ideas that I have been thinking about and have even made some cardboard models of some preliminary shapes to figure out a ram air tunnel for a future bike project. I also had some ideas to help with removing engine heat.

But I was just wanted to know if Solidworks had some programming to help me further design some ideas.

[shift1313]

well do a search for floworks (used to be cosmos floworks) With this you can model thermal efficiency and air flow(like enter the radiant heat from the engine and the airflow in front of the bike and it will calculate heat transfer etc. With 09 you can even do stress models with composite materials! However I dont have floworks(just floexpress) so I dont have knowledge of the capabilities first hand, but i dont think it will change the shape of your model but it will tell you hot spots and things like that.

 

here is something i modeled using floexpress in SW08 and 09. The flow conditions are very restricted and it must be internal flow with one inlet and one outlet, so i drew a tunnel of sorts.

 

ill have to find a link, i know i uploaded a pic onto the forum somewhere.

http://s268.photobucket.com/albums/jj39/shift1313/cad/

 

if you go there and browse through my"junk" there are some cfd stuff in there, and a menu on the left thats cfd. ill find a link to the flow/aero thing i did.

[shift1313]

if you check this post i have in the showcase forum, page 5 has a screen shot for you.

 

http://www.cadtutor.net/forum/showthread.php?t=29986&page=5

 

if you go back to page 4 you can see a render of the camera housing. its going to be mounted on a vehicle and i needed to know some things about my shape.

 

off hand i dont know of any software that gives an efficiency number. These softwares will give you velocity or flowrate numbers on your surface and heat generated by the air. With this data you can modify your design and re-evaluate. Are you trying to design fairings for some sort of high speed bike? because the aero stuff really wont make a huge difference til after 150mph

[ricracer16]

Well I will be modifying some current bodywork and then moving on and making my own bodywork. I don’t really need actual efficiency number but just to see a visual of the bodywork and virtual airflow around the bike and rider.

 

It would be for a bike but not high speed, it’s actually trying to reduce the drag of any kind and helping with the reduction of heat to the rider and lastly help the bike be more aerodynamic will help since the bike doesn’t have much horsepower.

 

 

This isn’t my bike but it is the type of bike my project is based on. This is a 450 cc dirt bike that has been converted to road race. It still has the dirt bike frame, engine, transmission and swing arm. They swapped out the front and rear suspension, bodywork, wheels brakes and some other odds and ends to what you see here.

 

From what I have read there are still some issues that need some tweaking on the bike but for the most part these bikes can be built for under $7000.00 and are a lot more fun than full sized street bikes ridden at track speeds.

 

So the biggest problem so far is the bikes only have 5 gears compared to 6 or standard rode bikes and the engine only produces about 45 to 50 hp compared to 600 cc street bikes making 100 to 114 horsepower. The biggest difference with this bike other than the big power difference is the weight. Modern 600cc are still weighing around 375-420 lbs while the 450 only weighs 240 lbs. Thus way more fun in the turns.

 

Sorry if I strayed and rambled on but bikes are my passion. So the whole reason behind me learning this technology is to get some of my ideas out in a media and planned out so that I can either build my parts or have them built. I’m not going to be building a bike anytime soon since there is a lot that I need to learn and I’m sure that I will probably working on this for the next couple of years.

As you can see from the photo above the muffler is close enough to the rider to shed some of the heat to the his or her right leg. A shield would work great there and there are many on the market now but right now none really get my attention so might as well design my own. Also there are other small areas on the bodywork and then of course machined parts.

Oh by the way you have a lot of work on photobucket! Some of those were very intricate and detailed. That camera set up is very nice as well. I've seen something like on MotoGp bikes.

[shift1313]

i know all about the supersingles:) they certainly are cool bikes but id rather take a crf450 like that one and turn it into a supermoto, just me though:)

 

Well if you just want a virtual "wind tunnel" solidworks will do great if you get floworks add-in. its designed for that.

 

here are some images i found on the net of someone using solidworks

 

 

[shift1313]

also ive done a lot of work with motorcycle design(personal) and also am a fabricator by trade and i do some composite work so if you need any pointers or help along the way let me know. Sounds like a great project!!

[ricracer16]

That is exactly what I was looking for. I just needed to know how the flow would actually look before and building a part only to find out that it doesn't work.

 

thanks for the advise and i'm sure i'll be asking you some questions in the future.

 

As for the SUMO's they look like tons of fun but road racing just gives me goose bumps.

 

Thanks again for the info.

[shift1313]

no problem man. if you need any bike info also let me know. Ive worked a total of 5 or 6 years in the industry and used to help out here and there with a few friends of mine that raced. and i did a bunch of MX. I still remember when the first supersingles started popping up with cr500 or kx500 motors. now those things were bad!

[ricracer16]

Aren't those 2 strokes?? I guess that was all about throttle control.

 

Yikes!!

[shift1313]

yeah the good ole days of raw power at the riders control. no FI, traction control or slipper clutches

[LobarInc]

haha sounds like death to me!

[ricracer16]

There is always the possibility of death but with 2 strokes there were more riders launched into the atmosphere if they became over confident or to greedy with the throttle.

 

The bike forced riders to become more skilled to find that edge of adhesion and stay within it. Nowadays there are more riders out there racing but the quality of those riders wouldn't be able to ride a 2 stroke 500. I’m not saying what they do on an 800cc MotoGP which makes over 230 hp is easy, by no means am I saying that but there must be a challenge. I don’t want to see some mediocre rider winning races simply because he has a technology that simply makes the race easier while there are riders who on machinery that they have to ride over the ability of the actual machine to qualify let alone score a podium.

 

I'm all about technology and advancing the bikes and sport but I don't want to see MotoGP turned into F1 which makes it almost like a video game.

 

The control has to be returned to the riders but with safety in mind. There were a lot more injuries back when the bikes had blue exhaust. I like the idea of 4 stroke technology but with all this traction and wheelie control. It’s just too much computer control.

 

I do like the idea of ending the 2 stroke era but they made a bad choice by using 600cc engines. That’s just dumb but I guess it is getting a bit out of hand in regards to the expenses and in today’s economy it was inevitable. I was just hoping they could have used a single cylinder platform. I guess the manufactures will get their way in the end. But getting back to the single cylinder idea, Can you imagine a GP super single!! I would think the technology could be rolled into smaller capacity OEM versions for the street and also used in the scooter and moped market which is huge in Europe.

 

I love motorcycle racing, it’s the best sport, event and entertainment ever created. What those guys do on motorcycles can’t be described with words. Oh yea the bikes are nice too.

[shift1313]

I wish they never got rid of the open class moto x class. The 500s were beasts!

 

I agree the technology on gp bikes has gone a bit far. Its so bad that the bikes have gps and the bike alter their tune based on rider input, wheel speed, gps speed and track position.

 

I love watching motocross and supermotard but motogp sometimes is hard to watch(except when its raining).

 

I would love to go back to the days of wayne rainey and eddie lawson when everything was rider control and the bikes were technologically great.

 

im sure you have probably already seen this site but just incase.

 

http://www.450moto.com/

[ricracer16]

Hey Shift,

I regularly check that site but unfortunately it has been updated in a while.

I love the idea and I’m hoping it will get bigger here in the states but considering today economy and there aren't many companies making parts for this class and some companies are making their parts so expensive that it goes against the spirit of the idea itself.

That is why I want to learn Solidworks, so that I can design and make parts for myself first then maybe when my ideas are good enough then maybe can be sold to the public.