My New CAD Station

[The Buzzard]

Hello Everyone,

 

Well, Its been about seven years since I last upgraded hardware and I can tell you this: "I should have done it sooner." The reason why I am posting this is in case others have gone through the same issues.

 

I have been working with a Dell Precision 360 workstation with AutoCAD 2004 and for the most part it seemed I could deal with it. Ever since the upgrade to AutoCAD 2009 I gained nothing but headaches. I was assured that 2009 was compatible for that system, So I was not sure if this was an ACAD bug. I kind of refrained from using 2009 at that point except to test AutoLisp programming in a more up to date version. Seems like a waste of software for the money. The ACAD program would just gobble up all available memory.

 

Recently I decided to upgrade hardware since I was getting low on hard disk space with the two 200GB hard drives I had and I realized the age of my system.

 

I thought about going a few steps up just to see if I could get around the problem issues I was having with 2009. I checked out Dell's Precision T5500 and assembled a system I thought would be good enough to get past the problem without going to overboard on price. I talked it over later with a Dell rep to see if they could do better on price and they seemed willing. Below is what I ended up getting and I just recently finished getting it up and running.

 

WHAT A DIFFERENCE!

 

I went with a Dual Quad Core Processor, (2) 500GB drives and a better Graphics Card and a larger Monitor to add to the multi-monitor I now have and this did the trick. For those who use their CAD for a living this was well worth the price. For me this is just a hobby, But I do like to work like a gentleman. To get your company management to invest this is hard to say. Its been some years beyond for me to understand how they do things any more.

 

Just wondering what your thoughts are on this.

 

So here it is:

 

1. Dell Precision T5500 Workstation

2. Dual Quad Core Processor, E5620, 2.40GHz, 12M, 5.86GT/s Dell Precision T5500

3. 4GB DDR3 ECC SDRAM Memory, 1333MHz, 4X1GB Dell Precision TX500

4. Dell, USB Quiet Keyboard, No Hot Keys, PWS, Black

5. Dual 1GB PCIe x 16 NVDIA Quadro FX 3800, Quad Monitor, DVI + 2DP, Dell Precision TX500

6. 500GB SATA 3.0GB/s with NCQ and 16MB DataBurst Cache, Dell Precision TX500

7. 500GB SATA 3.0GB/s with NCQ and 16MB DataBurst Cache, Dell Precision TX500

8. C2 All SATA or SSD Hard Drives, Non-RAID for 2 Hard Drives, Dell Precision T5500

9. No Flopp Drive, Dell Precision

10. Windows 7 Pofessional Downgrade to XP Professional SP3, No Media, Fixed Precision, English

11. Dell Backup and Recovery Manager for WinXP, MUI, Latitude, Precision, OptiPlex, Vostro

12. Windows 7 Downgrade RLOB

13. Dell USB 2 Button Optical Mouse with Scroll, Black Precision

14. Mini-Tower Chassis Configuration, Dell Precision T3400,T5500

15. 16X DVD+/-RW Data only Dell Precision TX500

16. Cyberlink Power DVD 8.3, No Media, Dell Relationship LOB

17. Roxio Creator Dell Edition 10.3, No Media, Dell RLOB

18. No Speaker Option

19. Precision T5500 Power Supply, C2

20. Documentation, English, Dell Precision

21. Power Cord, 125V, 2M C13, Dell Precision

22. Integrated Intel Chipst SATA 3.0GB/s Controller, Dell Precision T3500,T5500

23. No Resource CD for Dell Optiplex, Precision and Latitude

24. Shipping Material for System Dell Precision T5500

25. Dell Hardware Limited Warranty Plus Onsite Service Initial Year

26. Dell ProSupport

27. ProSupport for End Users 7x24 Technical Support and Assistance for End Users, Initial

28. ProSupport for End Users 7x24 Technical Support and Assistance for End Users, 2 Year Extended

29. Resource DVD contains Diagnotics and Drivers for Dell Precision T5500

30. Quick Reference Guide, Dell Precision T5500

31. Trend Micro Internet Security, English, 30 Day Trial

32. Special Pricing Applied

 

This system was over $5000.00 before discounts.

 

Subtotal: $3306.55

S&H $0.00

Tax $293.48

Envior Fee $0.00

Total w/discounts $3600.03

 

Dell, ST2410 24" Flat Screen Monitor $199.99

 

Reusing Three (3) Existing Dell ST2010 Flat Screen Monitors

 

The image below shows the (4) Monitors with the 24" to the Left followed by (3) 20" Monitors.

[ReMark]

Only $3600? Only??

 

I'm glad someone is making the "big bucks"!

 

Sweet. I'm jealous. Can I borrow it for a year or two? LOL

[Cad64]

Wow! $3600 to build a system for something that's just a hobby? Must be nice.

I think you could have purchased a really good machine that would have been capable of doing everything you need it to do for about half of what you paid though. The dual video cards account for about $1600 alone. And the dual quad processors are about another $1000.

 

Can I ask why you need 4 monitors? I would have just gone with the one video card and stayed with my dual monitor setup.

 

And why the dual quad processors? Are you doing 3D renderings? If you're just doing CAD work and other general computer work, a single quad processor would have been more than enough.

 

If you take out one of the quad processors and one of the video cards you're down to about $2300. That's much more reasonable, IMO, and just as effective, performance wise. You would have only been able to hook up 2 monitors, but other than that, you would not have seen any performance issues. And your wallet wouldn't have been impacted quite so much either. But if you can afford it, great, go for it. I just can't justify that type of expense for myself.

[alanjt]

Man, I'd cut someone for a machine half as good as that one.

[The Buzzard]

I was under the impression that this machine was nowhere near a pro-workstation. There are CAD stations for $15000.00 to $20000.00 that fall in that class. I thought it would be nice to have something only better than what I have used in the past years. The multi-monitor setup was something I had work on for a while gathering used monitors. I wanted to replace an old 21" Viewsonic CRT for the 24" Dell, But for quite some time I had used (3) monitors. The fourth monitor was planed on for some time. Once you use a multi-monitor setup, It is hard to go back to less. The video card I now have is only considered mid-range. I have tinkered with 3D, But plan to get more involved soon.

 

Most of the issues I had stemmed around poor performance. The old Precision 360 was a station that was thrown out by a company to be replaced by another. It suited my purpose until I had installed 2009. I would not use 2009 after the install as it became a problem especially when the layer manager was open, The cursor would start jumping around. I stuck with 2004 as my CAD of choice. Now that this issue is resolved, I can start making use of 2009.

 

CAD seems more enjoyable when you do not have yo do it for a living anymore.

 

If you are going to do something for yourself, Then try to do it right.

[Cad64]

I was under the impression that this machine was nowhere near a pro-workstation. There are CAD stations for $15000.00 to $20000.00 that fall in that class.

 

That's true, but those machines are extreme rarities. You will really only find machines like that in high end mechanical engineering firms where they are running really high tech programs that do intense calculations and rendering. Your typical run of the mill CAD drafter is NOT working on a $15,000 machine. He's lucky if he's working on a $1,500 machine. I would guess that your machine is probably better than what most of the guys on this board are using as their daily work station.

[The Buzzard]

That's true, but those machines are extreme rarities. You will really only find machines like that in high end mechanical engineering firms where they are running really high tech programs that do intense calculations and rendering. Your typical run of the mill CAD drafter is NOT working on a $15,000 machine. He's lucky if he's working on a $1,500 machine. I would guess that your machine is probably better than what most of the guys on this board are using as their daily work station.

I do agree with you there. Dells base model for the T5500 was $2442.00 and the T3500 was around $1071.00. Most companies will get a better deal off the asking price, But do not expect much in the way of add-ons. You basically work with whats in front of you like it or not. Since I am not subject to company decisions I was hoping to get a cream-puff. If this is going to be a hobby for me then I want it to be most enjoyable. I think it is fair to say that from working professionally with a low end station and the expectations of the volume of work expected by the company is in contrast. You always get what you pay for. Ok, That might be a bit over the top. Sorry if I interfered with the budget of Managements golf outing.

[ReMark]

I would have gone with one graphics card not two and spent the money I saved on more memory. This I would have bumped up to 8GB or even 12GB but to do so would have required one other change. You should have made the switch to Windows 7 (64-bit) either the Pro or Ultimate addition rather than downgrade to XP. Finally, I would have looked at a 24" (or higher) wide-screen LCD. Four monitors is ridiculous unless you're designing cars, planes or doing a lot of video editing.

[The Buzzard]

I would have gone with one graphics card not two and spent the money I saved on more memory. This I would have bumped up to 8GB or even 12GB but to do so would have required one other change. You should have made the switch to Windows 7 (64-bit) either the Pro or Ultimate addition rather than downgrade to XP. Finally, I would have looked at a 24" (or higher) wide-screen LCD. Four monitors is ridiculous unless you're designing cars, planes or doing a lot of video editing.

I like the fact I do not have to minimize or maximize programs, I can have several programs open all within my view. I have had this setup for years and I can say with confidence you get more done. With the dual processors the memory required that I have is fine and no need for more at this point. The performance is good all around. I can always add more if needed. Windows 7 has not been out that long for me to feel comfortable with so XP is my choice. And finally 64-bit is very nice, But all my apps are 32-bit and it did not make sense to replace all them. What I did here may not be right for some, But as for me this works well.

[ReMark]

You're right. But is it a good idea to be straddling the line?

[The Buzzard]

You're right. But is it a good idea to be straddling the line?

Maybe you can straddle, But the best I can do for my age is waddle.

[BBHP]

Nice build!

 

To me (IMHO), it feels kind of unbalanced. With XP and 2x1GB video cards, the most RAM you can use is limited to 2.5-3GB mark, which kinda limits multitasking. If all your apps are 32bit, you can use "XP mode" feature that comes with Win 7 Pro.

[The Buzzard]

Nice build!

 

To me (IMHO), it feels kind of unbalanced. With XP and 2x1GB video cards, the most RAM you can use is limited to 2.5-3GB mark, which kinda limits multitasking. If all your apps are 32bit, you can use "XP mode" feature that comes with Win 7 Pro.

 

 

I am not so sure about that. On my previous computer I also had dual video cards with alot less memory and muli-tasking was never an issue. With the setup I have now it seems all the apps run smoother and quicker even if there is alot open already. That was one of the things I imeadiately check for when I got the system. You still need to take into concideration the faster processing speed which I believe make all the difference.

[dtaylor]

64 bit is the way to go. Why limit your self on RAM when its so important. Also why limit yourself to an outdated technology. 32 bit is the past. Same goes with XP. Windows 8 is projected to launch as soon as late2011 even. There's also talk of it having 128-bit compatibility. Most 32bit applications out there still run in Win 7 64bit with no issues. Plus if you ever manage to run into one that wont run you can just fire up xp mode.

[The Buzzard]

64 bit is the way to go. Why limit your self on RAM when its so important. Also most 32bit applications out there still run in Win 7 64bit with no issues. Plus if you ever manage to run into one that wont run you can just fire up xp mode.

 

As I have said before, I love the performance of this station as it is now. I do not see the point in going 64-bit with 32-bit AutoCAD. I know I will not be upgrading AutoCAD for some time to come. If I upgrade in the distant future I would most likely do it that way or any new way that may be available for the times. My decision was based on what software I am currently using.

[dtaylor]

If i was going to spend so much money then I wouldn't want to start out with a technology crippled system. There's cheaper setups that will run 2009 fine. And then there are also huge 2d or complex 3d .dwgs that will surely bring max out your 4 gigs of ram. Just think, 32 bit your limited to 4 gigs. 64 bit your limited to 192 gigs in win 7.

[The Buzzard]

If i was going to spend so much money then I wouldn't want to start out with a technology crippled system. There's cheaper setups that will run 2009 fine. And then there are also huge 2d or complex 3d .dwgs that will surely bring max out your 4 gigs of ram. Just think, 32 bit your limited to 4 gigs. 64 bit your limited to 192 gigs in win 7.

 

I doubt this system is technolgy crippled. It serves my purpose and then some. I am not implying there is anything wrong with 64-bit, But that will happen in my time when I am ready and have 64-bit apps. I have tested this system on some complex 3D drawings and its quite impressive. For me to go 64-bit and downgrade to XP at this point in time is like buying a Rolls Royce only for going to the local grocery store. When I have everything in line to go that direction you can be sure I will get 64-bit at the right time. Now is not the right time. I can add additional memory when I feel its needed. I am currently using NVIDIA Performance Drivers for 2009 and this does the trick. I had 2009 for a couple of years and was unable to use it on my previous system. I need to get my moneys worth out of it now. When I upgrade to a newer release I shall do it then with all 64-bit apps. I am very pleased with what I have now.

[bobsy852]

haha *drools* at the 2xQuad Core! !!! sick!!

I need a second graphics card! Or just simply a better one! haha nice system mate! Very Impressive!

[DVDM]

Impressive specs, but like someone else said, a bit unbalanced. I can imagine you're very pleased with it though, and you can really let it loose once you go 64-bit.

 

Fortunately at my work they spend decent money on workstations, so everyone here has a nice T5400 at the moment (

 

If I was to spend that kind of money on a dell t3500/5500 workstation, I would have done things differently:

CPU: Get the fastest single processor for the budget, 3.2Ghz 4-core or even 3.33Ghz 6-core. Maximum speed for the single core apps (i.e. AutoCAD & Inventor), and plenty of cores left for multi-tasking or the odd multi-threaded task.

HD: 80 Gb SSD boot drive, big 1Tb drive for the files.

OS: I find Win 7 64-bit fantastic. Was always happy with XP 32-bit, but Win 7 really feels better in every way, even with 4Gb of RAM.

RAM: 4Gb was already a pleasure to work with, but would get 8 or 12.

Graphics: A single 3800 (or the new 4000 which was just released) and 2 monitors would do me. My neck would start to hurt from constantly turning to each of those 4-displays I'm using a single 22" right now, and I can't say I desperately need a second one. The Windows 7 window snapping is actually pretty helpful in splitting the screen between two apps.

 

Oh well, just day dreaming!

[Gmhall]

I built my HP XZ6600 workstation for only $1200 which has 2x E5450 3.0ghz processors, 20gb ram and a quadro 4000 graphics card. =)