Lost in Windowsland.

[Dana W]

I have not seen anything about this particular combination mentioned any place.

 

I have a brand spanky new 64 bit, 6 gig ram, Windows 8 machine. My 32 bit machine died suddenly.:shock:

 

I know one can download a vm pc XP package that makes it possible to run older 32 bit programs on Windows 7 64 bit machines, in XP mode. The Microsoft site does not say whether that download works with Windows 8, nor does it list one similar for Windows 8.

 

What I need to do is install and run AutoCad LT 2009 32 bit, on my new 64 bit Win 8 machine. Has anyone else found a way to do this sort of thing?

[Dadgad]

Have you checked out LONGBOW?

[Dana W]

Have you checked out LONGBOW?

No, but I will in a minute. Thanks.

[SLW210]

What problems are you having loading AutoCAD as is?

 

WOW64 is the x86 emulator that allows 32-bit Windows-based applications to run seamlessly on 64-bit Windows. WOW64 is provided with the operating system and does not have to be explicitly enabled.

 

Most programs designed for the 32-bit version of Windows will work on the 64-bit version of Windows. Notable exceptions are many antivirus programs.

 

Device drivers designed for 32-bit versions of Windows won't work on computers running a 64-bit version of Windows. If you're trying to install a printer or other device that only has 32-bit drivers available, it won't work correctly on a 64-bit version of Windows.

[f700es]

Not sure if this will help you but worth a look.

 

http://lifehacker.com/5965889/how-to-run-windows-xp-for-free-in-windows-8

 

With this you'll need to install oracle VirturalBox - https://www.virtualbox.org/ - which is a OS virtualization program. Then download the file from MS and follow the directions of using the virtual OS image. All free and appears to be legal as well.

[Dana W]

What problems are you having loading AutoCAD as is?

 

None yet, since I have not tried to install it on the win 8 machine. I have been told by the techy dood at work that it won't work (very buggy results), but I have also heard otherwise here on the forum, and I have been told by others that it will work virtually transparent with no ad ins or shells.

 

I am in the middle of a system crash and recovery. My 6 year old 32 bit machine has been rendered unusable so I have to move to the new 64 bit win 8 box.

 

I have Knoppix VM loaded on a flash drive which will boot virtually anywhere. At last resort, I might try that, but in the meantime I will look into WOW64 and virtualbox.

 

With these virtual machines, has anyone experienced having the files created not showing up in windows later? Do they always have to be accessed in the VM OS?

 

By the way, I had to resort to buying a hack program to recover my files from the old OS drive. Yes, I know there are free ones, but you pay in other ways for those. If anyone ever faces this issue, a USB adapter and a program called FileScavenger both saved my cookies, big time. The FileScavenger license cost me 50 bucks but it was worth every penny to me. It is a solid, and very well thought out program, but it could use a little more of a 'User Manual'.

 

I appreciate all the help people, very much. I have to take some time to get this all sorted out, but I will lwt you all know what sort of luck I have with it. I may also just decide to update my CAD software instead. It is getting to be time for that.

 

Does anyone want to see some photos I clicked on and deleted 5 years ago? I found a few.:shock:

[Dadgad]

Not the fabled bar tendress of your youth?

[irneb]

With these virtual machines, has anyone experienced having the files created not showing up in windows later? Do they always have to be accessed in the VM OS?

The VM is just that a Virtual Machine. Even the XP-Mode is simply Microsoft's VM with XP installed inside that.

 

It's as if you have a 2nd PC running inside your PC, with its own hard drive / ram / CPU / operating system / programs / data files / etc. Usually the VM's hard drive(s) are stored as single large files, see these as similar to a huge ZIP file, unfortunately though not all of these can be opened like a ZIP file (depends on the VM manager and some setup options), and I'd be sceptical on trying to open them as such - no knowing what could go wrong.

 

There are ways to share between the main PC (host) and the VM (client) - usually this is as if they're linked through a network with shared folders. Not sure how other VM managers do this, but in VBox you can set which folder(s) to share to the client. then the client can read from and save to that folder. This is the easiest sharing to setup.

 

With a bit more setting up, you could do it the other way round: create a share in the XP client and map to that from the W8 host. But personally I don't like this idea: you'd need to start the XP client before the W8 host can connect to that folder.

 

Another alternative would be to use a raw disc through the VM manager. That way the client has direct access to the HDD, not through a virtual disc which is actually a file on a HDD. This is a lot more difficult to setup, and could cause corruption if you don't know what you're doing. E.g. if you have a RAW disc mapped to the XP VM while it's also mapped to the W8 host the 2 operating systems could be reading/writing to that disc at the same time and do some truly disastrous stuff in the process. So I don't recommend this for anyone not expert in VM's.

[irneb]

BTW, you think you've got issues? Try this one for size: A programmer needing to write stuff for different OS's needs to run different OS's with the same source code. But most OS's use their own file systems, and some of them can't be opened in other OS's. No matter what he tries, what File System he attempts to use, there's always some issue somewhere - some OS's don't want to work with it, others only open it in read-only mode, others corrupt the data, others only work very slowly with that FS, some file systems have restrictions on file size and/or names and/or disc sizes.

 

The only full solution would be to have a file server for your data (something like a NAS). And since that guy only has one PC, where can he put this server? The only answer (work-around which actually works): a virtual server running inside each of the dual-booting OS's on his PC.

[Dana W]

Not the fabled bar tendress of your youth?

No, my youth is more than 5 years behind me.

So you're sayin' that a forensic search of your hard drive is not going to find anything from that Victoria's Secret browse, the history of which you thought you deleted?

 

By the way,

I loaded AutoCAD 2009 LT right out of the box to my 64 bit machine,

gave Autodesk my firstborn in the form of my existing serial number and clicking the "Agree" button on I know not what,

ran SP 3,

and it's doing fine so far.

 

The only issue I have is remembering to put my recovered custom cui file in my search tree tomorrow so I don't have to change everything again.

[Dana W]

The VM is just that a Virtual Machine. Even the XP-Mode is simply Microsoft's VM with XP installed inside that.

 

It's as if you have a 2nd PC running inside your PC, with its own hard drive / ram / CPU / operating system / programs / data files / etc. Usually the VM's hard drive(s) are stored as single large files, see these as similar to a huge ZIP file, unfortunately though not all of these can be opened like a ZIP file (depends on the VM manager and some setup options), and I'd be sceptical on trying to open them as such - no knowing what could go wrong.

 

There are ways to share between the main PC (host) and the VM (client) - usually this is as if they're linked through a network with shared folders. Not sure how other VM managers do this, but in VBox you can set which folder(s) to share to the client. then the client can read from and save to that folder. This is the easiest sharing to setup.

 

With a bit more setting up, you could do it the other way round: create a share in the XP client and map to that from the W8 host. But personally I don't like this idea: you'd need to start the XP client before the W8 host can connect to that folder.

 

Another alternative would be to use a raw disc through the VM manager. That way the client has direct access to the HDD, not through a virtual disc which is actually a file on a HDD. This is a lot more difficult to setup, and could cause corruption if you don't know what you're doing. E.g. if you have a RAW disc mapped to the XP VM while it's also mapped to the W8 host the 2 operating systems could be reading/writing to that disc at the same time and do some truly disastrous stuff in the process. So I don't recommend this for anyone not expert in VM's.

 

BTW, you think you've got issues? Try this one for size: A programmer needing to write stuff for different OS's needs to run different OS's with the same source code. But most OS's use their own file systems, and some of them can't be opened in other OS's. No matter what he tries, what File System he attempts to use, there's always some issue somewhere - some OS's don't want to work with it, others only open it in read-only mode, others corrupt the data, others only work very slowly with that FS, some file systems have restrictions on file size and/or names and/or disc sizes.

 

The only full solution would be to have a file server for your data (something like a NAS). And since that guy only has one PC, where can he put this server? The only answer (work-around which actually works): a virtual server running inside each of the dual-booting OS's on his PC.

 

Yah know, a simple pat on the head and "don't worry, it'll be ok." woulda been sufficient.

 

Luckily, I didn't have to worry about tryin' any of that sorta stuff this time.

 

I was an applications programmer from 1982 to 2005, and never had to learn much about how the insides of my magic box work. I think I actually avoid every opportunity to learn about it now, out of some sort of subconscious need to stay relaxed and happy.

 

I really do appreciate the information but I don't think I can even qualify for a concealed carry permit for the Knoppix boot drive I made.

[Dana W]

Alrighty then. AutoCAD LT 2009 will run on a 64 bit Windows 8 machine without any sort of outside help. The graphics card in this thing is a little weak but it'll get me there. I even got my custom cui file from my old machine loaded. I guess the story is over for now, at least until I see an issue. If I have any, I will post about them. You'd think at 2560 x 1440 res, I wouldn't have jagged diagonal lines. That reminds me to update my computer specs.

[SLW210]

How is Windows 8?

 

Might go ahead and bite the bullet and get a new computer.

 

My wife is tired of hearing me curse my old Win XP Pro Laptop AMD Duron from the last Century.

 

My old PIII 933MHz is pretty quick running Linux Distros on Live CD, particularly DSL is very fast, for some reason though my older CDs (only 2 yrs old) aren't reading well and seems the write isn't working (I have 2 CD drives 1 is Read/Write 1 Read only), I downloaded some fresh distros on New CDs with my work computer and they seem to run fine. I guess the CD drives need cleaning or may be wearing out.

[Dana W]

Yah know, a simple pat on the head and "don't worry, it'll be ok." woulda been sufficient.

 

Luckily, I didn't have to worry about tryin' any of that sorta stuff this time.

 

I was an applications programmer from 1982 to 2005, and never had to learn much about how the insides of my magic box work. I think I actually avoid every opportunity to learn about it now, out of some sort of subconscious need to stay relaxed and happy.

 

I really do appreciate the information but I don't think I can even qualify for a concealed carry permit for the Knoppix boot drive I made.

 

Gee, my reply sounds kind of flippant now that I re-read it. I didn't mean it that way. I was just saying that I really don't know enough to be able to use some of the suggestions but the help is greatly appreciated.

[Dana W]

How is Windows 8?

 

Might go ahead and bite the bullet and get a new computer.

 

My wife is tired of hearing me curse my old Win XP Pro Laptop AMD Duron from the last Century.

 

My old PIII 933MHz is pretty quick running Linux Distros on Live CD, particularly DSL is very fast, for some reason though my older CDs (only 2 yrs old) aren't reading well and seems the write isn't working (I have 2 CD drives 1 is Read/Write 1 Read only), I downloaded some fresh distros on New CDs with my work computer and they seem to run fine. I guess the CD drives need cleaning or may be wearing out.

 

I personally like Windows 8 on the whole, It's like a smartphone with a 27" mouse enabled screen. It's as though they crossed an Android based phone with a Mac, but I do have some issues, at least psychological ones, I suppose.

 

it makes it more difficult than ever to get into the inner workings of things. Unless you have a short cut on the desktop, or an "App" on the App Screen, it is difficult to find how to run a program that is installed. I miss the "Start Button" which I hear, is coming back in an August update.

 

I can't find anything that looks like the old Programs menu. The App Screen is driving the rest of the family nuts, but I have taken a little time to learn to use it. It isn't so bad really. I still have not learned how to close an app without resorting to the task manager. Windows and/or Microsoft Help is worse than ever. I don't think it even looks at what I type into the search line. It either answers a question with another question or displays a bunch of articles that have more relevance to which 'screen' I am on than what I want to know. No more Index View of Help?

 

Boy, do they ever want us to get into the "cloud". A new feature that came along with the new OS, is a globally usable "Microsoft User Account". It seems I can sign up, share anything on my computer to the cloud, and then access it and edit it from my smartphone, from anywhere there is cellphone or wifi access. Sorry, I am not all that trusting of the cloud yet even though it is supposedly encrypted and passphrase protected.

 

Aside from all that, Win 8 and 64 bits makes for a blazingly fast OS. It is slick, sharp, shiney, and entertaining. On my old machine, 32 bit, 2+ ghz, AutoCAD LT 2009 would take almost a full minute to load for the first time after booting. On this machine I timed it at 16 seconds.

 

Any day now, I will get up the nerve to see if Win 8 talks to AutoCAD enough so I can tap a single object, or finger drag a window over a bunch of 'em.

 

I hope there is a system constant in AutoCAD called Touchscreen, and it is permanently set to "Nooo!!!. A thousand times Noooo!!!"

[rkent]

To close an app you grab it at the top and drag it to the bottom of the screen.

[irneb]

Yep, fingering for CAD is a big no! Especially if your fingers are "fat" like mine it becomes difficult to see what intersection you're "touching"

 

But you don't need to use the touch in W8 do you? And there are already some programs you can install to get the Start menu back if you prefer it (some of those are even free / open source).

[Dana W]

To close an app you grab it at the top and drag it to the bottom of the screen.

 

No, wait. It has to be more difficult than that.

[Dana W]

Yep, fingering for CAD is a big no! Especially if your fingers are "fat" like mine it becomes difficult to see what intersection you're "touching"

 

But you don't need to use the touch in W8 do you? And there are already some programs you can install to get the Start menu back if you prefer it (some of those are even free / open source).

No, touchy is not required, but it does make the bonding period go faster.

 

I am using one of those Start Button programs at work, not sure which one. Someone else installed it. That one is very XP'ish with grainy graphics.

[rkent]

No, wait. It has to be more difficult than that.

 

There are several free apps that take you through using w8, they are very helpful and they don't take long. I am used to not having the start button since the w8 interface is a start screen, just start typing and it is found.